KB type flight controls

[danmcgee]

Ok I can make complete KB type flight controls to any size. They are operated on bearings instead of the bolt pins the originals had. Bolt together no welding heavy duty made for those none UL but also have the light ones for the UL users all made from 6061 T6 and AN hardwear. I have the stock on hand to make 4 at the moment if anyone is interested please pm me.

Trying to get the funds for a new mill with a CNC attachment so I can make Rotor heads as well.

 

[Jim Edwards]

Ok I can make complete KB type flight controls to any size. They are operated on bearings instead of the bolt pins the originals had. Bolt together no welding heavy duty made for those none UL but also have the light ones for the UL users all made from 6061 T6 and AN hardwear. I have the stock on hand to make 4 at the moment if anyone is interested please pm me.

Trying to get the funds for a new mill with a CNC attachment so I can make Rotor heads as well.

Ok, Dan. I'm interested. What is your price? I have a B8M. You can call me at 479-747-4323.

 

[danmcgee]

Oh I guess that would have been good info 200$ that should not be bad.

 

[danmcgee]

Oh I am using .125 wall on all stock so it is very strong none of the thin stuff.
here is how they are made.

 

[danmcgee]

Two gone if you guys really like these I will order more stock and make more for all those that want them.

 

[Dirtydog]

danmcgee : Flight controls look very good. :whip:

 

[tcastro]

Hi Don

The KB copy of the control looks great and the price is good

Good luck

tcastro

 

[GaryMac]

Dan,

Sent you a PM on this.

Thanks, GaryMac

 

[danmcgee]

Well OK then I guess I will order more stock, I will be cutting the four for those that have sent me a PM this week end and get them ready for shipping. If you want one just keep PMing me and I will add you to the list.

Dan

 

[danmcgee]

I think I will try my hand at one of those Davinci gadgets wounder if I could make his helicopter fly. LOL

Dan

 

[animal]

They look good,only thing that concerns me,is the pivot stub being held in by a Rivet. I think you would be a lot safer with a 3/16th bolt thru it.

just my 2 cents

 

[Aviomania]

Dan
I do not want to sound negative but that stick has some important structural problems.

If you use rivets use aircraft type that retain the mandrel all the way and have increased shear strength as well as use the correct no of rivets for the material and strength required.

use fillets and not sharp angle cuts. They can develop cracks after time. ( on the L shape pivot brackets as well as on the sq. tube. If you see the plan it has a constant ark cutout... follow the plan)

kinks on the stick tube bends are a NO NO .. especially at the low part.

Make this corrections and you will be offering an otherwise nice stick at a good price.

Again... I am sorry if i sound like a critick.... I just want as ALL to do the best we can to promote safety in our sport.. and a control stick a life threatening part if not done properly.

 

[Passin' Thru]

Dan
I do not want to sound negative but that stick has some important structural problems.

If you use rivets use aircraft type that retain the mandrel all the way and have increased shear strength as well as use the correct no of rivets for the material and strength required.

use fillets and not sharp angle cuts. They can develop cracks after time. ( on the L shape pivot brackets as well as on the sq. tube. If you see the plan it has a constant ark cutout... follow the plan)

kinks on the stick tube bends are a NO NO .. especially at the low part.

Make this corrections and you will be offering an otherwise nice stick at a good price.

Again... I am sorry if i sound like a critick.... I just want as ALL to do the best we can to promote safety in our sport.. and a control stick a life threatening part if not done properly.

I second what Nicholas said. When I noticed those items in the photos, it made me a bit uncomfortable.

 

[HobbyCAD]

Being a copy of the KB controls or not, is the geometry not flawed here? With a little bit of juggling, it could be improved. Take the center picture in post 1, the roll torque tube is on the bottom, the pitch push-pull tube on top. When applying a roll input, the pushrod Y-fork sweeps left-right, while it applies the up-down input to the pushrods. For pitch, it works fine.

Why not make the 2 bearing holder pivot stubs a bit higher, make the top tube the hinged roll torque tube, have the bottom yoke of the joystick fork over the torque tube, and mount the push-pull pitch tube on the bottom. Have the pitch hinge of the rear pushrod Y-fork on the level of the roll torque tube, with the pitch arm down to the bottom mounted pitch push-pull tube. That way, you have minimum left-right sweep of the pushrod Y-fork, while applying roll inputs. A much better geometry, not so ??

My 2-cents worth.....

 

[Aviomania]

Being a copy of the KB controls or not, is the geometry not flawed here? With a little bit of juggling, it could be improved. Take the center picture in post 1, the roll torque tube is on the bottom, the pitch push-pull tube on top. When applying a roll input, the pushrod Y-fork sweeps left-right, while it applies the up-down input to the pushrods. For pitch, it works fine.

Why not make the 2 bearing holder pivot stubs a bit higher, make the top tube the hinged roll torque tube, have the bottom yoke of the joystick fork over the torque tube, and mount the push-pull pitch tube on the bottom. Have the pitch hinge of the rear pushrod Y-fork on the level of the roll torque tube, with the pitch arm down to the bottom mounted pitch push-pull tube. That way, you have minimum left-right sweep of the pushrod Y-fork, while applying roll inputs. A much better geometry, not so ??

My 2-cents worth.....

it takes to much effort for a perfect geometry with a 2 point 2 axis floating system, ( Torque bar and stick V tubes have to operate in parallel, same pivot places and same lengths). 3 or 4 push/pull rods are easier to make for a perfect geometry ( & safer).

Normally on Gyros, Roll pivot axis is lower than pitch axis on the torque bar so it compensates some of the geometry mis much of that system.. in other words.... it works fine.

 

[GYRO J]

The kb control, exept for the joy stick was all 4130 moly steel not aluminum

 

[danmcgee]

Cool, The rivets are Cherry aircraft rivets but I can change them to bolts to easy. L brackets can be cut rounded on edges ver much like the ones you would get from strbee gyros to easy. Why would I need to make the mount towers longer they are the exact same as the original KB except I use a high inpact high velocity sealed bearing in place of the original adjustment screws I don't understand why I should do that. This system was originally 4130 welded steal but I have heard so many on here talk about welds breaking so bolt together is so much better but I guess that depends on who you are talking to that day, that goes for alot of things on here depends on who you are talking to.

I can make all those changes easy enough. The stick I am using has a 1/8 inch wall but did get a new tube bender that will make the bends so much cleaner if not them I will have to use the same thin walled tube the original system used to make such a clean bend. .065 wall.

The point to this is to provide an economical FC system that is safe and long lasting. We should not have to break the bank to build a gyro.

For the Y fork I will increase the size slightly so no cuts will be nessessary so no sharp edges. Making them better per your suggestions. This way they can still be made to any size for any gyro, kind of one system fits all just need a little longer tubes for different gyros.

How does that sound to all of you.

Dan

 

[animal]

Sounds like you are on the right track to offer a nice control stick as a good price.

 

[Alan_Cheatham]

Actually, if you analyze what load the rivets are subjected to you will realize that they are only taking a shear load that is caused by the bearing friction and do not carry the control system torque. Further, drilling a hole completely through the tube for a bolt will just increase the tubes weakness and the tube is sandwiched between the bearing blocks so it can't slip out unless the blocks move.
.

 

[danmcgee]

Yes you are correct Alan, however if folks are not comfortable with the system then there is no reason to offer them. I have already increased the wall thickness from those that are made of alum out there being used today on some systems and .125 has a UTS of 45000 and a YS 40000 I can not see anyone ever putting that much load on any FC system. But I am not an engineer and will listen to those out there with experiance and make the modification mentioned.

Again the whole goal here is to offer a safe and affordable system to all of us, I'm cheap I can not see myself spending 500 plus for flight controls no matter how weel they are made there just is not that much material or time in them to constitute that much cost. The rivet would be fine but the bolt is just as easy as the rivet just drill the hole all the way thrugh.

Dan