Not yet. Design faults postponed the production start.
And who actually is having here a quality problem?
China or US.
The World is a changing...
Gyro factory in china
- Thread starter pkk
- Start date
Not yet. Design faults postponed the production start.
And who actually is having here a quality problem?
China or US.
The World is a changing...
Early Bird Dave
Newbie
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- 445
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- St Augustine, Fl.
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- Dominator Tandem and single
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- 500+
May I add training to the list.
Having ability to train in like aircraft prevents accidents which lead to a bad reputation and lost market share.
Having ability to train in like aircraft prevents accidents which lead to a bad reputation and lost market share.
Friendly
Platinum Member
What engine are you looking to use?. Something by you, or will you purchase and add to your gyro.
We need a reliable 4 stroke engine Like the HKS but 70 + hp. Do you currently have such an engine in China?
We need a reliable 4 stroke engine Like the HKS but 70 + hp. Do you currently have such an engine in China?
giro5
Senior Member
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- Mar 19, 2006
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- Farmington, New Mexico
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- prev- citabria,AA1b, fun racer
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- 400 GA, 50 trike
Just my 2 cents. (and I have never manuf. anything) If a tube frame like the Air Command was used I think China should review two things. First look at the quality of the XAir airframe welded up in india. Second look at the quality of the chromemoly tubing and welding used in XXX sprint car frames from China. Get quality tubing and quality welding (with appropiate inspecting) and the basic frame is handled (assuming the design is good). Shooting to keep it light and possibly ultralight legal in the US. Sell the frame ready to go. Review Rutan's composite work for the emmpenage and use his techniques to produce the vert/horiz/rudder. Work with either the parent of 2SI engines or the MZ line to furnish a good 2 stroke power plant as good as and cheaper than rotax. And as I said earlier have some financing available or sell major items for under 2000 each for people who want to build as they can afford. And I would make standard the overhead stick control for lightness,simplicty and cost and have a stick cyclic availble as an option. Lastly I would initially use someone's ready to go light weight blades and rotor head. Using existing ones of these last three items (engine, blades and rotor head)would lead to easier acceptance. What you do not want to do is order 1-10 thousand of these items and drive a manuf to lower quality trying to meet a sudden high demand for their product.
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Firstly , thanks to Rotoplane, Joe Pires, Gyroguy, friendly, Early bird Dave and Giro guy for your kind comments, support and questions, which reassures were on the right track.
Yes Quality is an issue to question and since the factory will follow an existing well know brand name and technology this will not be an issue which should create doubt or barriers for a China built product. Quality no matter what field is always the forefront of any manufacturing from clothing to space ships and I see in the news these days that American built Toyotas are having trouble at the moment.
The Demo , Idea from Gyrtoguy as well as other good points is an excellent idea thnxs and this will be proposed in the sales launch. Its the intension of the Chinese to have world wide support sales and service and training centres from all localised ares in each country( tenders will be invited ) each operation must have adequate backup capabilities sales and service centres including flight training. This must be a professional approach to achieve integrity.
The new engine for each craft has been sourced from the Japanese company of Subaru, using the Subaru 25, for those of you not aware of this engine its an excellent choice and in the future R & D will develop hybrid power sources.
A price point would be interesting to put out there , if anyone has any serious thoughts about this I am sure that it will not fall on deaf ears
Yes Quality is an issue to question and since the factory will follow an existing well know brand name and technology this will not be an issue which should create doubt or barriers for a China built product. Quality no matter what field is always the forefront of any manufacturing from clothing to space ships and I see in the news these days that American built Toyotas are having trouble at the moment.
The Demo , Idea from Gyrtoguy as well as other good points is an excellent idea thnxs and this will be proposed in the sales launch. Its the intension of the Chinese to have world wide support sales and service and training centres from all localised ares in each country( tenders will be invited ) each operation must have adequate backup capabilities sales and service centres including flight training. This must be a professional approach to achieve integrity.
The new engine for each craft has been sourced from the Japanese company of Subaru, using the Subaru 25, for those of you not aware of this engine its an excellent choice and in the future R & D will develop hybrid power sources.
A price point would be interesting to put out there , if anyone has any serious thoughts about this I am sure that it will not fall on deaf ears
RotoPlane
Gold Supporter
Touché
. I was hoping you would say that you're using a new light weight diesel engine. Less fire hazard.... As to price....I'd like to see, oh say $10,000 USD .Rotoplane........ Thnxs for your comments but I said serious price for a serious craft, maybe I never explained what is going to be presented to market well enough and cant give too much details at this sensitive stage. What I can say is though it will not be a kit but initially but a fully factory built craft, which at the moment I would say that any thing out there in the market at the moment that is sold from a well known brand must be at least 45K for a kit and at least 95K for something like the M24 delivered built. So 10K is not realistic or commercial, although I would like to say yes.
I know that most would say that the joy of building your own is the main reason for enjoying the flight and the sport but thats not the aim at the moment. So if you or any others have any serious thoughts I am sure they would be well noted
I know that most would say that the joy of building your own is the main reason for enjoying the flight and the sport but thats not the aim at the moment. So if you or any others have any serious thoughts I am sure they would be well noted
Friendly
Platinum Member
Well,
I can see now that it is going to be a two seater. the subaru is too heavy for single place machines. I thought we were going to get a real manufactored machine for a minute. I know the subaru is a good engine, just too heavy for single place machines. It is the cost of reliable engines that drives us to the automobile market.
I can see now that it is going to be a two seater. the subaru is too heavy for single place machines. I thought we were going to get a real manufactored machine for a minute. I know the subaru is a good engine, just too heavy for single place machines. It is the cost of reliable engines that drives us to the automobile market.
RotoPlane
Gold Supporter
I hope you knew I was kidding about the price Paul, kinda .
It's in a very affordable range for CEO's, lawyers, doctors and bankers......
.It's in a very affordable range for CEO's, lawyers, doctors and bankers......
Friendly
Platinum Member
I not too smart, now Chuck, Doug, Al, Udi, those are smart people. Any one who has been around gyros for a year or so , or anyone who has built one from scratch would know you don't put that much weight on a single place. And we would not put it on a two seater if we could afford a light engine.
Rotoplane, yes I thought you were kidding but thats a very funny comment about affordable for CEO's Lawyers , doctors and bankers , maybe you put the comma in the wrong place ? Especially since the HSBC boss Michael Geoghegan earns a basic salary of £1.07million (usd 2.6 m ) a year, and is entitled to a maximum annual bonus of £4.3million ( usd 51.3m ) , anyway no offence taken in your low ball price / wish list but can say its the aim of the company to put a gyro out there for a price with reach everyones pocket otherwise how will it succeed or be any different from anything out there at the moment. What I would say is that if a factory built gyro can hit the market for the price of a kit then thats an achievement , what do you think ?
BEN S
Super Member
Pkk...
Pkk...
a certified gyro in the US market with a price point around what the kits sell for (25 to 35 thousand for a twofer) would definitely make waves here. I am curious are we thinking SXS or in-line?
Ben S
Pkk...
a certified gyro in the US market with a price point around what the kits sell for (25 to 35 thousand for a twofer) would definitely make waves here. I am curious are we thinking SXS or in-line?
Ben S
RotoPlane
Gold Supporter
If you can make a two place certified gyro for around the average price of a kit….then yes that would definitely be an achievement. I certainly hope you guys succeed!
UtahBenson
Newbie
Certified??
Certified??
I would love to see this concept become a reality. My questions are do you know how many companies have worked closely with the FAA to certify a gyro, the investement they have made and where they are currently with certification. I watched GBA spend more than a decade and millons trying to do just that. They have a fine machine which is a blast to fly, very stable and well built if done right and they still do not have a type certificate. Jay Groen spent a lot of time in China trying to work a deal with the government but it never became a reality. If you plan on pre-assembled aircraft, you take away the option for the owner/pilot to be able to do the anual inspection unless he/she is also an A&P which adds more to the cost of opperation. Then there is the cost of shipping. I was wishing I was going to see something in my ballpark but it is looking like some serious change here.
Anyway I wish you all the luck in the world and success for the company. I'm sure there is a market for such a thing but I believe doctors, lawayers and government chiefs may be the owners you are looking for. Just my 2 bits...probably all it's worth.
Certified??
I would love to see this concept become a reality. My questions are do you know how many companies have worked closely with the FAA to certify a gyro, the investement they have made and where they are currently with certification. I watched GBA spend more than a decade and millons trying to do just that. They have a fine machine which is a blast to fly, very stable and well built if done right and they still do not have a type certificate. Jay Groen spent a lot of time in China trying to work a deal with the government but it never became a reality. If you plan on pre-assembled aircraft, you take away the option for the owner/pilot to be able to do the anual inspection unless he/she is also an A&P which adds more to the cost of opperation. Then there is the cost of shipping. I was wishing I was going to see something in my ballpark but it is looking like some serious change here.
Anyway I wish you all the luck in the world and success for the company. I'm sure there is a market for such a thing but I believe doctors, lawayers and government chiefs may be the owners you are looking for. Just my 2 bits...probably all it's worth.
giro5
Senior Member
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2006
- Messages
- 1,272
- Location
- Farmington, New Mexico
- Aircraft
- prev- citabria,AA1b, fun racer
- Total Flight Time
- 400 GA, 50 trike
In the Us to me there are about 3 kinds of gyro buyers. The low end -Bensen, gyrobee or used or scratch built models of these (under 10 K). Then, new : ultrawhite, sportcopter and aircommand (up to around 20K). And then the higher priced Magni, Sparrow Hawk etc ( 20-50K).
From the latter posts this gyro is in the higher price range. It will be quite interesting to me to see if a world wide market exists for these to the extent necessary to keep a manufactur in business.
You can get a used fixed wing that will fly at least a third faster, has a certifired engine, a comparably good safety record and will carry 4 people for this price range. Sure there will be a few owners who will buy just to fly "a gyro" with nice ammenites but how many remains to be seen. Personally my money is on the "Bensen" concept. The gyrobee is the modern version of this. What I would like to see is Little Wing type tractor with a 447 with a 72 in prop., overhead stick, and with just the tail feathers covered. Dragon wing blades and rotor. I think this could be a legal ultralight, a safe plane, and could be new for under $8000. But then I am on the lower income level personally and I might be biased.
From the latter posts this gyro is in the higher price range. It will be quite interesting to me to see if a world wide market exists for these to the extent necessary to keep a manufactur in business.
You can get a used fixed wing that will fly at least a third faster, has a certifired engine, a comparably good safety record and will carry 4 people for this price range. Sure there will be a few owners who will buy just to fly "a gyro" with nice ammenites but how many remains to be seen. Personally my money is on the "Bensen" concept. The gyrobee is the modern version of this. What I would like to see is Little Wing type tractor with a 447 with a 72 in prop., overhead stick, and with just the tail feathers covered. Dragon wing blades and rotor. I think this could be a legal ultralight, a safe plane, and could be new for under $8000. But then I am on the lower income level personally and I might be biased.
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