Safest Gyro

[98InTheHole]

P. S. If you want to learn more about the Butterfly line of Gyros, I would be happy to talk to you about why I belive they are a great machine. Send me a personal message through the forum with your contact information and I will get back to you.

PM sent. Thanks.

 

[Learjet]

Can anyone tell me if the Orion M24 has a landing gear impact absorbing suspension? Couldn't find any info and it doesn't look like it does. (I'm somewhat leaning towards that gyro at the moment, opinions?)

Apart from the nose-wheel, the main undercarriage on all the Magni gyros is a composite construction sprung cantilever, which from my training days (and less than elegant landing every now and then) could very well be defined as having "impact absorbing" capabilities :wacko:

 

[Heron]

All Butterfly gyros will rank high on safety, probably safer than all.
Given the same parameters they will bring home the bacon as we have seen the abuse they took all these years and still fly.
If we have to vote in one, I think the Monarch is the safest.
Heron

 

[Vance]

Please don't pretend.

Please don't pretend.

I am an NTSB enthusiast.

I read the accident reports every day and try to learn from them.

I have a hard time remembering a death in a gyroplane accident that could have been prevented by long stroke suspension.

The long travel suspension is a nice feature but please don’t pretend it is more than it is.

In my opinion there are not enough of Larry’s gyroplanes out there to imagine that there are meaningful statistics.

I do not see a gyroplane emerging as the safest because the numbers are so small.

My advice would be to study the numbers you can find and draw your own conclusions.

You are more likely to determine the least safe gyroplane from your studies.

Find a good instructor that you can relate to that does not have a lot of dead students and pay attention.

Thank you, Vance

 

[hillberg]

According to the FAA the safest gyroplane is assembled by the highest standards with the most skilled mechanic, Painted for corrosion by the best painter then cast in 11000 lbs of cement.

 

[Heron]

Parameters Vance! Parameters . . .
You just closed a window to fit your vision.
Small accidents happen all the time and many of them render the pilot some cuts and bruises, the machine mangled. Long stroke suspension will reduce the damage, that is added safety.
It will also, increase the number of spots that will be suitable for landing, lowering pilot workload, again increased safety.
WE had quite a few pilots hurt and or killed by prop strike, having some means to avoid that would be added safety, but not in flight.
And so on and so forth.
I can see your little duck feet pedaling under the placid lake . . .
Heron

 

[PW_Plack]

I am an NTSB enthusiast. I read the accident reports every day and try to learn from them. I have a hard time remembering a death in a gyroplane accident that could have been prevented by long stroke suspension...

Vance, it doesn't have to be fatal to be unsafe. Non-fatal accidents involving small rotorcraft are often unreported, including many which are legally required to be reported under FAR 830. The NTSB database isn't much of a guide here, because so much is left out.

I hope to avoid even those accidents which don't kill me.

I also read NTSB reports daily for almost a year before I started taking instruction. The leading cause of accidents, fatal and otherwise, is grossly careless decisions by pilots, usually in consecutive groups of decisions. My expectation that I couldn't possibly be so careless is tempered by my suspicion that they probably didn't think they could, either.

It seems as though many ground accidents involve pilots who got the mains off the ground before they were proficient and confident in getting those wheels safely back in contact without lateral drift. I don't know whether very long gear travel will prove to be a net benefit in these cases. (It's greatest advantage may be allowing drop-in landings without damage on unimproved surfaces.) Hopefully, such designs will eventually sell well enough to draw meaningful conclusions.

...Find a good instructor that you can relate to that does not have a lot of dead students and pay attention.

What a direct, brief, accurate piece of advice!

 

[birdy]

I have a hard time remembering a death in a gyroplane accident that could have been prevented by long stroke suspension.

The long travel suspension is a nice feature but please don’t pretend it is more than it is.
Zactly Vance.
If the suspension saved your ass, you stuffed it up a while ago. [ pilot error]
If flown properly, you only need wheels to take off. You can land on skids.

 

[Vance]

The question I was answering.

The question I was answering.

Thank you all for the replies.

What do I mean by safe? That would be the gyro I'm the least likely to die on

Daniel asked a specific question and I was answering it without pretending.

Heron I find your pedantic rambling annoying. Please direct it elsewhere. You are probably the person least likely to understand why I said something.

Hello Paul,

I heard a story that the man who designed the original Mini felt that the excellent handling would prevent accidents. It was reported that the accident rate remained the same just at higher speeds possible because of the better handling.

In my experience there is no telling how people will react to something. What I have seen so far is some pilots with the G force landing gear seem to forget how to land and don’t develop what landing skills they have. I have not seen enough to have an opinion as to the value as a safety device.

Mariah Gale will have longer travel suspension because it will give me capabilities that I don’t have with The Predator with her short travel un-dampened mains and rigid nose gear. These off airport excursions may cause me to roll her up in a ball.

In my opinion people who destroy their aircraft and it costs them time, money and heartache learn important lessons that may save their lives.

I am more careful about packing parachutes now.

Thank you David,

I feel you are wonderfully capable of dispassionate observation. I feel smarter when I agree with you.


Thank you, Vance

 

[Heron]

Vance
It was nice meeting you and all the people . . .goodbye!
Heron

 

[AndyTille]

landing gear- frame

landing gear- frame

Hi Gregorius, have a look on the main landing gear and the frame near the ground, i think the cyprus autogyro got a very poor shock absoring landing gear. In a wrong high energy vertical landing (baloon) the suspension get no way to absorbe the energy, the frame will hit the runway and the hole gyro got a shockload, heavy G forces on all components. What happend than is just luck or badluck.........the saftes gyro must have a high energy absorbing landing gear to eliminate energy from wrog landing and get a soft tuch. Andy

 

[birdy]

I feel you are wonderfully capable of dispassionate observation.
Not sure wot that means but, I feel smarter when I agree with you. you make me feel civilised wen i read your posts.

 

[rfsolutions]

Here are some of the features in my SCII that I consider to increase the safety of the pilot & passenger.

• Aluminum bonded "Sport Rotors"
• Dual bearing rotor head
• Lycoming IO-360
• Certified MT-Propeller
• Integrated fuselage "Roll-over" protection
• High G rated seats
• Full stroking suspension (springs & variable rate shocks)
• Castering nose wheel with differential brakes (reduces roll over probability)
• Triple rudder for increased maneuverability
• Rear facing camera for "Line up & wait" and "clear prop"
• Flir camera for increased safety of night operations
• Centerline thrust design
• hands off-feet off stability

 

[98InTheHole]

Here are some of the features in my SCII that I consider to increase the safety of the pilot & passenger.

• Aluminum bonded "Sport Rotors"
• Dual bearing rotor head
• Lycoming IO-360
• Certified MT-Propeller
• Integrated fuselage "Roll-over" protection
• High G rated seats
• Full stroking suspension (springs & variable rate shocks)
• Castering nose wheel with differential brakes (reduces roll over probability)
• Triple rudder for increased maneuverability
• Rear facing camera for "Line up & wait" and "clear prop"
• Flir camera for increased safety of night operations
• Centerline thrust design
• hands off-feet off stability

I actually like the SCII a lot, it certainly does seem to have a lot of good features. I read somewhere that there is a wait of a year to purchase one, does anyone know if that's true?

 

[rfsolutions]

Since my SCII is the first to fly with the Lycoming & all the engineering issues have now been resolved, Jim & his crew are currently working on finishing the other few machines for customers that have been patiently waiting. Cooling a Lycoming engine in a rotor craft (especially a pusher) was an engineering feat that was solved with such efficiency that I can only say that I'm amazed every time I fly it! We actually had to reduce the size of the oil cooler to get the oil temperatures up to normal operating temperatures! My McCulloch J-2 can only wish that it's engine could run this cool.

The performance is spectacular for a gyro this size & the above mentioned safety features all perform as designed! I plan on posting plenty of pictures & videos in the future.

Delivery times for new orders are estimated to be 5-6 months from time of purchase. This could change if the orders stack up as anticipated?

I'm a dealer here in AZ and will be giving demo rides all winter! Anybody that makes their way to Phoenix will be welcome to take a flight.

 

[Brent_Brown]

what can the max weight of the passenger be?

 

[rfsolutions]

I have personally flown a 6'3" passenger that weighed 280 lbs on a 100 degree F day. I have a friend that is 6'7" and weighs 310 lbs and I plan on giving him a ride when he has time (I will be taking video of this of course). It appears that anyone that can climb into the SCII can fly it or be flown in it. This is not a light weight marginally powered aircraft. We don't burn 2000' of runway in ground effect trying to fly passengers.

How much do you weigh?

 

[Brent_Brown]

that sound good

 

[Learjet]

I have personally flown a 6'3" passenger that weighed 280 lbs on a 100 degree F day. I have a friend that is 6'7" and weighs 310 lbs and I plan on giving him a ride when he has time (I will be taking video of this of course). It appears that anyone that can climb into the SCII can fly it or be flown in it.

Please take care to factor in your MAUW weight with respect to Density Altitude, particularly if you're giving demo rides to members of the public. Unfortunately, this is often exactly how the unwary get caught by Density Altitude as it's not a constant entity, and just because one got away with it yesterday, or the day before, or the weeks or months before with passenge & pilot weighing x lbs, does not mean that the day will not come when the weather gods conspire to have a density altitude that bites the unway (over)loaded gyro which previously "never had a problem taking off"....

 

[dragonflyerthom]

98

Most of the berates on this forum will run the RAF down but one of the most popular poster on this forum (Birdy) owns a RAF. Go figure that one out. Anyone want to dispute this. Chuck B???? For comfort, economy, price, and when modified a little the RAF is the hands down winner. Oh and I wouldike to add that if this is your first gyro get a small single place first. It's like buying a Harley for your first motorcycle