Help with part 103

[wanafly]

Hi all... I've been snooping through the forum and quite frankly I'm really impressed... Such a collection of wonderfully talented and inspired oddballs. -Please don't take offense; that's a compliment!

I live at the edge of the woods in southern Washington and am interested in any flying clubs in the area. But more to the point, the wonderful exression of freedom that part 103 seems to offer. So far I've read so much of ya'lls bantering about the hardware that I now dream on Dragon Wings but my dreams are to tool up and have some aluminum ones pulled!

Back to the question: Is part 103 still active? Can I really build and fly (or crash) in a home built plane without asking the FAA for permission? Is the weight 254 lbs with or without the 30 lbs of fuel?

Also, first time to any kind of forum, so please excuse any poor manners but please do advise! :hail:

Thanks,

Keith

 

[Resasi]

Hi Keith. Welcome to the oddballs, some more talented and inspired than others, all in love with wings that spin.

Great place to come for advice and assistance. 103 alive and well. Yes you can build and fly without FAA permission but he does still call the shots eg he set the 103 limitations.

Sincerely hope you don't crash. For your sake, it's painful/terminal; ours, because that brings the sport into disrepute. No need to either. Do the research, build carefully to the plans, take advice from knowledgeable sources. Do train and do take lessons from an instructor, that's serious life insurance.

For your first visit you've done well. Be polite respect others and you'll be fine.

If powered:
(1) Weighs less than 254 pounds empty weight, excluding floats and safety devices which are intended for deployment in a potentially catastrophic situation.

Newbie like you and enjoy having a place to hang and read all about gyros.

 

[wanafly]

Thanks for the encouragement and the safety tip.

I don't know how I can help in the group, 'cause I haven't any experience with these amazing machines, but I am an engineer, love to build electronic stuff, and may be able to help with some of the calcs. I've noticed that there are a few flyers that don't yet have a grip on the numbers! (love these little guys).

I've been thinking about a really cheap rotor tach, but don't want to step on anyone's commercial toes...

Actually, the wife and kids don't want me anywhere near an airplane, let alone one with TWO high velocity objects attached; they don't want to lose me, so I just may have to help where I can and admire from the ground.

 

[All_In]

...

Actually, the wife and kids don't want me anywhere near an airplane, let alone one with TWO high velocity objects attached; they don't want to lose me, so I just may have to help where I can and admire from the ground.

It's all good were glad to have you join us.

But warning if you really wish to stay on the ground then. Do NOT take that first ride in one, certainly not with Ron or Steve, there is just no going back then. You will find yourself sneaking out of the house to learn how to fly.

 

[Doug Riley]

Hi, Keith:

There are gyro pilots in your state. In fact, I know a couple of 'em personally. Contact the Popular Rotorcraft Association (www.pra.org) for some names and addresses.

A Part 103 gyro is necessarily a stripped-down model, with no enclosure, no or minimal prerotator, few instruments, a low-powered 2-stroke engine and rather dinky fuel capacity. (Photos of mine below). Some people are fine with these limitations; others can't stand them. Matter of personal taste.

You still need instruction whether you are art 103 compliant or not.

 

[Timchick]

I've been thinking about a really cheap rotor tach, but don't want to step on anyone's commercial toes...

Some of us use a $10 digital bicycle speedometer. If we could save some money with your idea let's hear it.

 

[Alan_Cheatham]

Keith,

Go to this page and download the two PDF files, they define what an Ultralight Aircraft is and how to determine if an aircraft complies with the regulations.

https://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_...8CF133AD5A5BA4B3862569DE005BD75A?OpenDocument

 

[wanafly]

Thanks all for your input. No, I can't beat 10 bucks for a bicycle speedo, so much for that thought; thank you Tim for the reality check. Still, something that reads in rrpm and maybe flashes below a preset value, with a simple setup for teeth/rotation...

Alan, thanks for the link.

If you know anyone that needs help understanding electronics, let me know.

contact: [email protected]

 

[wanafly]

Doug:

That's a really nice rotocraft, thanks for the pix. It looks like you've simplified the collective, opting for a hang-glider style control, right? In pitch, this must be opposite from the more complicated push-rod approach, yes? Is this a problem, or does one adapt quickly?

Keith

 

[Doug Riley]

Keith:

As with most small gyros, this one doesn't have a collective, only cyclic (the one that tips the rotor in any direction of the compass).

The control stick is the original design promulgated by Bensen over half a century ago. The throttle is a Harley twist-grip on the right handlebar. I used it because it's light, simple and cheap.

Yes, the sense of motion of this stick (called an overhead stick in gyro parlance) is the same as a trike, but opposite from a floor-mounted stick ("joystick"). People who start with a joystick aircraft (or perhaps joystick video games) have endless trouble adapting to an overhead. I happened to have learned on an overhead in my teens, so I've not lost the ability to use one.

These days, you can't get training on an overhead-equipped gyro trainer, however; there simply aren't any in service. I imagine a seasoned triker would have little trouble making the transition, though.

The pictured gyro is a Watson Gyrobee; in fact, it's THE Watson Gyrobee. Doc Watson didn't finish it before selling it to me. The Gyrobee is the only gyro I'm aware of that is specifically designed to comply with Part 103. As I mentioned earlier, most manufacturers find the law too restrictive to allow them to produce an attractive product -- so they don't even try.

 

[wanafly]

Doug:

Very interesting, thanks for the details. If I build a gyro, it will be my own design, depending heavily on what others have proven. All I figure is needed is a good motor (Rotax 447?) a prop and a pair of blades... Everything else is pretty much home buildable, provided you have a machine shop. Considering the complexity of wings and motors, you have to do a lot of work to get up to more than 51% (home built) of the whole assembly!

Further, I'm attracted to a welded airframe, and my guess is that you've got some comments on that...:flame:? My distant memories of the Piper airframe, while doing engine preflight checks, was that the whole thing was welded. Yet, it seems those building planes at home are bolting tubing, plates and angle stock together. Any thoughts?

Was the Watson gyrobee welded or bolted? Did you add the overhead stick?

Finally, were do I get details of the pushrod configurations? I've been all over the forum looking for these specific details.. I guess I need to find a rotor airstrip and get nosey!

Thanks

 

[Alan_Cheatham]

Keith,

It is possible to build an ultralight gyro with a welded steel airframe, Ron Heron designed one called the Littlewing, but you would need to be very careful about weight to comply with part 103. Now, if you were talking about a welded aluminum gyro that would be out of the question unless you know exactly what you are doing, both in welding and design.

Alan

.

 

[Tom_Millican]

GyroBee

GyroBee

Considering the complexity of wings and motors, you have to do a lot of work to get up to more than 51% (home built) of the whole assembly!

Keith;

51% rule does not apply to Part 103 vehicles. Only applies if you want to be able to service and repair an experimental aircraft which you build (51%).

Check out the Gyrobee. Plans built ultralight gyroplane, and the plans are free for download here: https://www.thegyrobee.com/. Thank you, Ralph E. Taggart!

Tom

 

[ezeddie]

PNW PRA Chapters

PNW PRA Chapters

Keith,

Has anyone from Scappoose contacted you? You will probably have to cross the creek and visit the Oregon group. They meet at the Scappoose Airport and generally use a building provided by Sport Copter.

Check the PRA groups listed here on this site or the PRA web site and you find all the info on the Oregon group. There is a PRA Chapter up I-5 at Auburn also, they are listed in both places shown above..........

Nice to have another gyro guy in the PNW..........

eddie..........
Spokane, WA

 

[Doug Riley]

My 'Bee is a stock Taggart/AEROTEC/Watson Gyrobee. The frame is Bensen-style bolted 6061-T6 tubing, angle and plate. (Doc bought the kit from my company, AEROTEC, Inc., then didn't want to finish it, so I bought it back for personal use. I added the overhead stick, 447, Tennessee prop, Rotordyne blades and other stuff to finish it.)

I think welded 4130 tubing is an excellent way to create an airframe. 4130's mechanical qualities are such that this type of frame affords better crash protection and fatigue resistance than aluminum alloy. The slightly poorer strength-to-weight ratio of 4130N is pretty much offset (with careful design) by the weight-efficiency of welding as compared to drilling large holes and bolting.

Still, few gyro builders bother with such a frame because (1) the material (thin-walled seamless 4130N chromoly tubing) is an expensive luxury product, (2) welding this stuff, while a lot of fun, is a sub-specialty of general welding that MUST be done right to be safe and (3) it's a helluva lot of work: you typically have to build a jig and cut and fit each of scores of saddle joints, tack the whole thing, finish-weld, stress-relieve, sandblast, prime and paint. Then you've got a spindly-looking jungle gym that begs to be fabric-covered: more work.

Control pushrod design is pretty standardized. I think Ernie Boyette at RFD/Dominator makes exceptionally good ones, but the older generic design is shown on the Bensen joystick plans. You simply turn a 6061-T6 sleeve with an OD to fit inside your tubing and a 3/8" fine internal thread. This sleeve is cross-bolted into the tubing and the male rod end bearing screwed into it. Use aircraft-quality rod end bearings, not the $2 ones sold at go-kart shops. The male shank of the bearing MUST be locked down with a jam nut.

 

[Ralph]

Just a comment on the overhead stick. If you could learn to fly a gyro staring with that configuration, all would probably be well. However, I don't think that a trike pilot can make an easy transition. I flew a weight-shift fixed wing for many years and I have also flown a trike. In fact, trikes are the only aircraft where I actually took a lot of training. Trikes fly with a light enough feel in cruise and in smooth air, but when things get rough, you really have to wrestle them around. A gyro on an overhead stick will fly with modest control pressures and movements at all times. When I tried an overhead stick on a gyro, all went well until I had to make an instinctive input to a sudden gust while barreling down the runway. The direction of my response was not the problem - it was the magnitude! Appropriate for a trike in those circumstances, but it gave me my only experience trashing a set of blades and other misc. hardware. There is not a thing wrong with the overhead stick, but you had best start with it and suitable training is not easy to find.

Ralph

 

[Doug Riley]

I've taken a few trike and hang-glider lessons; never soloed.

I'd agree with Prof. Taggart about the differences in pressure and magnitude of motions.

 

[Jazzenjohn]

I believe the origional Mitchell flying wing used an overhead stick.

There are several flying gyros that have a small overhead stick as a control backup, mostly Carlinators. It seems to me that the only realistic path to flying them safely, is to fly with a regular stick and then transition to the overhead via a dual setup on your own gyro?

 

[Doug Riley]

... or get an enterprising flight instructor to add an overhead to his trainer. In the days when gyroglider training was the norm, many 2-seat traniers had both types of stick.

I was planning to do so myself until the FAA cancelled the BFI program and put all of us BFI's out of business.

 

[Resasi]

Were there a lot of hoops to jump in converting a BFI to regular gyro instructor Doug?