What is it about Gyros, and is there anything we can do about it?

Vance

Gyroplane CFI
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Tyrogyro, now if you REALLY want to ruffle some feathers, correlate the ages of the accident pilots to see if you can come up with a demographic pattern.

i.e. "Why yes , you can fly a gyro at 70 years old for the first time sir, but recent studies have proven that even with all your money and free time you have an 82% chance of a blade flap in an ELA before your first 100 hours! Still want to buy it?"
In the study I did of 34 gyroplane accidents with final reports the average age was 61.5.

I just trained someone for their 80th birthday.

He was one of my best and fastest learners.

I have an 84 year old coming for training in April.
 

BEN S

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Hmmm.....what do you think guys? Should I????

Nah....too easy.
 

TyroGyro

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I've not looked much at ages. Some are very young (21/22), some are quite old (70+).
I doubt it's worth the effort.
 
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loftus

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Unfortunately age is a factor in most cause of death, gyros and flying in general are no exception.
 

Brent Drake

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I find it hard to teach anyone over the age of 70 unless they have pryer flying experience. The reflexes and memory recall are too slow. Anyone over the age of 60 with no flying experience I have them take the written 1st. This tells me the memory is still up to par. I've turned down several over the age of 80. 80 and above I give them around 10 hours. Then I tell them I will be out of town for a few weeks. When they return to train, I find out how much they have not retained if they have forgotten I come up with an excuse not to fly with them anymore. I will not hurt their feelings. If a person has had several years of flying experience in the younger years then teaching to fly gyros is a completely different story.

I'd like to thank the admins for getting me back on the RWF.
 

Abid

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I've not looked much at ages. Some are very young (21/22), some are quite old (70+).
I doubt it's worth the effort.
Its worth the effort. Dig in. Insurance underwriters are not stupid when it comes to money. They will analyze the data they have with data scientists 100 different ways to confirm where and why they are losing money and to cut their risk
 
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Abid

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I wrote this on Bensen Days 2022 thread but it fits here as well:

"
Mike Goodrich is here and we have installed GWS (Gyroplane Warning System) on our trainer. We also did some testing with flap angle measuring system installed.
GWS is in Beta test with us. So far what I have seen from the data (10 data points of airspeed, G loading, rotor RPM and altitude, Outside Air Temp every second) is that I have gone in very gusty conditions today (15 gusting to 25 knots) and flown legs at 35 knots, 55 knots and 75 knots and in these flights I have gone as low as 0.62 G and got a bunting risk alert. I was in below 1 G for about 7 seconds total with lowest being 0.62 G for 0.3 seconds and I did nothing except hold the stick in place and let it recover and it did. I can see if I was ham fisted and abrupt and took actions that worsen the situation that I would have gotten bunting risk warning to bunting red alarm warning. Of course I did not do that because I know better. I had various 0.7 or 0.6 G transient hits due to turbulence and they came and went without any issue or alarms. This simulates the real weather flying and how gyroplane handles the normal transient low Gs. Basically without any real issue. The rotor RPM decays at the fastest rate at around 0.6 G, even faster than 0 G according to Jean Claude calculations as unintuitive as it sounds.

I have induced flapping alarms by going on takeoff roll with stick forward, starting at 140 rotor RPM trying to bring the stick more than half way but not all the way back and moving forward (this one was actually quite difficult to induce flapping warning, I really had to push stick well forward and really try and increase the throttle or the rotor RPM would pick back up. I induced a flapping warning from 80 rotor RPM, but it went away fairly quickly by nursing the rotor RPMs up.

All this data is recorded and can be graphed and specific points can be zoomed in on. No matter what I think happened or say happened, the data tells the real story. All this time the flap angle measuring device shows the flap angle via blue tooth on a phone app.
Its a great tool to simulate what a pilot may tell was the story and see if it actually creates the flapping danger the pilot said happened without actually being in danger. All I have learned so far, its difficult to flap the rotor. You really have to plug up multiple things badly. I guess if you have really lost the plot that bad, you can do it and you probably need more training or practice in handling situations like the tower. You have to remain pilot in command no matter what a tower tells you to do. You are ultimately responsible for the decisions you are making and accepting. As an engineer this data is great to see and it tells the real true story of what is going on.

If you are at Bensen Days definitely attend the GWS presentation by Mike Goodrich and Chris Buchanan. Chris was surprised at how accurate GWS has been so far. He flew in the back seat as the data collector with me. Mike is trying to make the presentation as simple as he can taking out the math bits so it should appeal to everyone."
 

Andino

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The rotor RPM decays at the fastest rate at around 0.6 G, even faster than 0 G according to Jean Claude calculations as unintuitive as it sounds.
That's very interesting! I shall have to read up on that.
 
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