.

About 50s-60s per 1000 feet (ish) or 11 miles per hour, I must calculate my descent rate.
 
That checks.
 
I can now understand how a vertical down to "terra ferma" is survivable as long as the rotor does not give a too close a hair cut
 
My M16 has a vertical descent rate at zero airspeed of over 1600 fpm.
I am surprised the M24 is that much different.
Of course if your forward airspeed is anything less than zero, that slows the descent.
 
There have been two videos I have seen, looked for but can't find either, of gyros coming down vertically to impact.

One was a student of Paul Bruty's in Australia who tried climbing away without lowering the nose and got behind the power curve. It wasn't from very high and he walked away. It was posted on this forum some years ago.

The second was I believe at a big US Airshow and came down vertically into some trees, and I believe they survived. No record of what their descent rates were, again seen on this Forum.

I believe Chuck Beaty or possibly another senior member elected to do a vertical descent into the sea. There are certainly occasions when one might consider it as an option.

A thick stand of trees that one is going to be unable to avoid might induce me to try it as an option if I knew that my vertical descent rate was around a 1000'/min when fully established because if one begins quite low then it will take time and distance to reach a terminal velocity and before that the descent rate will be much lower.
 
I don't think that was a "ZERO" Indicated Airspeed Vertical descent; watching the clouds, there was a little bit of forward/horizontal movement also.
A "0" IAS would appear as a vertical in the moving air-mass relationship, and the clouds would have appeared stationary in the sight picture; with the ground movement/relationship as an indication of the "wind speed" over the ground.
A "0" Ground Speed would hold a stationary point over the ground and the IAS would be equal to the Wind Speed of the Air Mass.
 
My M16 has a vertical descent rate at zero airspeed of over 1600 fpm.
I am surprised the M24 is that much different.
Of course if your forward airspeed is anything less than zero, that slows the descent.
Would be interesting to have data on various blades sizes and total machine weights to compare how descent rates vary at zero or near zero indicated air speed
 
OK, here's some of my data:
Rotor diameter: 28 feet
Propeller diameter: 5 feet, 7 inches
Width (landing gear): 5 feet, 11 inches
Length (not including rotor): 15 feet, 5 inches
Height: 8 feet, 11 inches
Weight: 597 pounds
Maximum takeoff weight: 1,212 pounds
Useful load: 615 pounds

I don't have the rotor width handy, but I should know that. Will measure it.
 
I don't think that was a "ZERO" Indicated Airspeed Vertical descent; watching the clouds, there was a little bit of forward/horizontal movement also.
Sure it was not 0 IAS, except during the first several seconds, otherwise yaw would be impossible to compensate with rudder.
 
What the hell, every rime I come on this forum I learn something!
I had no idea that the sky was 9000 feet high OR that a gyro could get up there;)
I learned something from your post too! Today I had no idea you even exist, and now I know you are coming to this forum and learning something every time. Good to know! :)
 
had no idea that the sky was 9000 feet high OR that a gyro could get up there;)
I discovered the higher I went in the Bensen the smaller the seat got.

Anything much over 5000' and the problem on landing was extracting the seat cushion.

In fact, due to the lack of any enclosure in an open frame machine, your lack of a coaming or enclosing nacelle as a horizontal reference left one with a decidedly unnerving lack of a horizon, or at least displaced so low down that it could induce a very mild state of vertigo.

And that in me who had for some years been quite accustomed to almost daily flying at altitudes in excess of 40,000' was interesting.
 
My first time over 5,000' AGL in a balloon had a related effect, but with no seat (or belts) at all, standing in a small basket with an upper edge that was only mid-thigh-high, and a little bit of sway thrown in for good measure, I had an uncomfortable worry about simply falling out.


Never had such worries while climbing mountains with big vertical exposure; but then mountains don't sway.
 
My M16 has a vertical descent rate at zero airspeed of over 1600 fpm.
I am surprised the M24 is that much different.
I agree with you that M25 is certainly not very different from M16
Accurate verticality gives a much greater sink rate (say 1700 ft/mn) than a 45 degrees glide angle (say 1000 ft/mn).

1000 ft/mn under 45 degrees, is an airspeed of only 15mph, which a Pitot or Venturi tube, oriented at 45 degrees to the flow, will indicates as about 0 mph
 
I had the same experience, all joking aside. When I went up beyond 5k I had to work up to it in stages.
 
Sure it was not 0 IAS, except during the first several seconds, otherwise yaw would be impossible to compensate with rudder.
The AR-1 can easily keep "0" forward airspeed and maintain almost full rudder authority - it has a humongous rudder surface compared to all other modern gyros.

With 8.8 m rotor, and single pilot, going straight down, I see vertical speed at close to 2,000 feet per minute, and if I maintain 10-20 knots forward airspeed I can greatly reduce the descent rate. A tight spiral would allow you to keep full control over your machine while still descending rather fast.
 
Cruising in an open gyro at 1200-1500 feet, I feel that I'm still "in" the landscape, not detached from it. Much above 2K, it gets lonely. I no longer feel part of the world below. That alone increases the pucker factor.

Several gyro pilots have, accidentally or intentionally, vertical-descended into the ground. One was a helo pilot located near me. He'd become an Air Command dealer back in the day. Maybe he forgot that he had no collective to pull at the bottom of his descent. There have been some minor injuries (e.g. cracked vertebrae) in these incidents, but nothing serious that I know of. The gyros all were piles of junk, though.

You need about 2.5 feet of gear travel, with steady, controlled friction throughout the gear stroke, to make a vertical descent that doesn't damage the gyro OR its occupant(s). The Butterfly G-Force gear comes pretty close. The Pitcairn-Cierva autogiros could do it, too.
 
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