More fun flying The Predator.

Vance

Gyroplane CFI
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
Messages
15,876
Location
Nipomo,California
Aircraft
Givens Predator
Total Flight Time
2200+ in rotorcraft
I am proud to know you David Craft and our calls brightened my day.
I wish you then best of luck with your new project.
 

Vance

Gyroplane CFI
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
Messages
15,876
Location
Nipomo,California
Aircraft
Givens Predator
Total Flight Time
2200+ in rotorcraft
UAVIONIX BUNDLE ECHOUAT WITH SKYFYX-EXT ALL-IN-ONE RECEIVER.
It is not installed yet.
 

Vance

Gyroplane CFI
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
Messages
15,876
Location
Nipomo,California
Aircraft
Givens Predator
Total Flight Time
2200+ in rotorcraft
Yes, I would like to fly to open hangar day at Santa Paula February second and unless I fly over a wilderness area I need to transition Santa Barbara's class C airspace.

I would like to have the option of flying to the Buckeye Air Fair February seventh and unless I want to fly over a lot of empty high desert I would transition Santa Barbara and Burbank's class C airspace and spend some time in the the Los Angles mode C veil.

I have a Sport pilot client that would like an endorsement for towered airports and I prefer to fly into Santa Barbara for that. I don't need to legally but I feel it is good experience.

I am waiting on the SKYFYX-EXT ALL-IN-ONE RECEIVER that is on its way from Peach Tree City, GA and should be here some time next week.

There is a long story that goes with why I don't have it yet.

It is a fairly simple installation that should not take more than a couple of days.

I would like to have four day available to install it so I don't get jammed up with a client.

There is always a list of things to do on The Predator.

I am about to replace the N numbers and go to a wig wag on my newly installed landing lights.

I want to install larger fuel tanks and new fuel level senders.

I have signs to install and I may install a second GoPro camera and I need to learn more about editing and how to use the camera for training.

I am also working on Gyropedia with a client.
 

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Tyger

Active Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2017
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308
Location
Germantown, NY
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Magni M16
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Vance, I'm not too familiar with SoCal airspace, except I know it's complex, but you can still fly under (but not over) the Class C without ADSB, as long as it's not also within a Mode C veil.
 

Vance

Gyroplane CFI
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
Messages
15,876
Location
Nipomo,California
Aircraft
Givens Predator
Total Flight Time
2200+ in rotorcraft
Vance, I'm not too familiar with SoCal airspace, except I know it's complex, but you can still fly under (but not over) the Class C without ADSB, as long as it's not also within a Mode C veil.
That is not how the tower at Santa Barbara feels Tyler.

I spoke with them recently and in their opinion I cannot fly anywhere in their airspace.

I also feel it is a safety issue because more people have their head down now looking for traffic. Without ADS-B I am invisible to them.

From the FAA website: https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/research/airspace/

Class CGenerally, from surface up to 4,000 feet MSL including the airspace above the horizontal boundary up to 10,000 feet MSL
 

Tyger

Active Member
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Messages
308
Location
Germantown, NY
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Magni M16
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If you are underneath the Class C, you are in Class E or G (or maybe D, as at Chino), and thus not in that Class C tower's airspace. If you look at the diagram in that FAA link you provided, you can clearly see that flying "under the shelf" of Class C is allowed.
Here is a good video that may clarify things further (it actually uses the area east of LAX):
As for the possibility of folks flying with their heads down, I don't think that will have suddenly changed much as of 2 Jan. Are you yourself planning to get ADS-B In, or just the required Out?
 
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Vance

Gyroplane CFI
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
Messages
15,876
Location
Nipomo,California
Aircraft
Givens Predator
Total Flight Time
2200+ in rotorcraft
I am going to have ADS-B out and in.

I find value in being able to see traffic behind me as they are usually going faster than I am.

I have a working relationship with all of the local towers and if they don’t want me to do something I don’t. Santa Barbara ATC does not want me flying under their shelf of class C so I don’t.

I have not found value in debating the regulations.

I could maneuver around to get to Buckeye without ADS-B out. It is not a limit I want to place on myself and I don’t have a compelling reason to make the flight.

It is simply a matter of getting the equipment for ADS-B in and out and installing it.

I feel it is inside my capability and budget.

I just procrastinated to find the best solution for me and I feel I still did not make the best choice given my particular desires.

My choice is close in both price and performance so I am happy with my choice.
 

Vance

Gyroplane CFI
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
Messages
15,876
Location
Nipomo,California
Aircraft
Givens Predator
Total Flight Time
2200+ in rotorcraft
The tail numbers on The Predator were coming apart and an unreadable tail number is a great way to meet someone from the DEA so Ashley of AC designs (805)801-4365 ordered some red vinyl and cut some new numbers. She took what was left over and made signs to make people aware that they could learn to fly The Predator. Ashley came to the hangar and had everything done very quickly and I think it looks great.
 

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DavePA11

Active Member
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Nov 16, 2015
Messages
389
Location
Northborough
Nice Vance!

Do gyro pilots prefer gyroplane or Gyrocopter? I know FAA uses gyroplane. Just curious. I always think they are more of a Copter than a plane.
 

Vance

Gyroplane CFI
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
Messages
15,876
Location
Nipomo,California
Aircraft
Givens Predator
Total Flight Time
2200+ in rotorcraft
Thank you Dave!

I don’t know about others; I prefer Autogiro because of its historic and romantic appeal.

I don’t like Gyrocopter because for many; it brings to mind flying lawn chairs, two stroke target drone engines, people teaching themselves to fly and all sorts of aviation mayhem.

In my opinion Gyroplane doesn’t have much romantic or historic appeal.

It is a little like calling a pilot’s license a pilot’s certificate.
 

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Tyger

Active Member
Joined
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Germantown, NY
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Dave: The two parts of the word helicopter are from greek helico (spiral) and pter (wing). The word itself was invented well before the machine was (1861). I imagine they were thinking of daVinci's drawing, with the big spiral lifting device.
So there really is no place for the "co" without the "heli" in whatever word you might want to use. If you prefer "pter" to "plane", "gyropter" (circle wing) would be more logical.
 

Vance

Gyroplane CFI
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
Messages
15,876
Location
Nipomo,California
Aircraft
Givens Predator
Total Flight Time
2200+ in rotorcraft
Unexpected Joy!

We had a great speaker at our San Luis Obispo EAA chapter 170 meeting and I wanted to try out my ADS-B out so I flew up from Santa Maria, Ca. (SMX) and got flight following. I asked Santa Barbara Approach if it was working and he saw my mode C transponder but could not see my ADS-B out.

Several people at the meeting assured me I was not the only one to have ADSB not work on the first flight.

Rob, a 500 hour Bellanca Viking pilot has been thinking about learning to fly a gyroplane and keeps finding excuses to not start his training.

I had just received my weather briefing and was working on my preflight when John (out chapter president) offered to give Rob a ride back to San Luis Obispo (SBP) if he caught a ride down with me. He did the same thing last month and it worked out great with Ted so as soon as I was finished with preflight I began briefing Rob.

Rob is quiet compared to many of the members in EAA so I knew little about his aviation background. I was pleased when he asked for a full briefing.

He allowed me to be my somewhat slow methodical self in the briefing and appeared to understand what I was trying to share.

It appeared to me that several of the members thought it was funny to have a 45 minute briefing for a 20 minute flight.

ATIS had the winds 310 degrees at 24 knots gusting to 31 knots and runway two niner was in use. The wind sock was straight out and twitching through about 30 degrees. This was not ideal conditions for a first flight.

Takeoff was sort of comical with about a 30 foot ground roll once I put the power to her. She sort of leapt into the air on a gust.

On our downwind departure I asked if Rob was ready for the aircraft controls and he requested that we exit the Edna Valley first.

When I did exchange the controls I could tell Rob had listened well and was focused on the sight picture and after a very short period of acclimation he settled down into a very steady airspeed despite the turbulence over the hills and managed his altitude to practical test standards.

People who don’t listen well may get focused on the airspeed indicator and quickly get behind the aircraft because gyroplanes respond to control inputs slowly. The goal is plus or minus 10kts and I never saw Rob more than 5kts off the goal of 50kts once he got a feel for it.

Most of my coaching was about low altitude navigation and power line avoidance. The sight picture is very different at 1,300 feet and the winds were strong enough in the Santa Maria Valley to kick up a lot of dust somewhat obscuring the airport. My instructions out of the Edna valley were head for the cone, then the water tower and then the left edge of the fields following the road on the edge of town to a right down wind for runway three zero.

When I checked the ATIS at Santa Maria wind was 300 degrees at 20 knots gusting to 28 knots with runway three zero in use. I felt this was too high for someone with 40 minutes flying a gyroplane and Rob was fine with that so I took the controls before turning base and made the landing.

The wind sock was fully erect at about 270 degrees.

I made a steep approach and we were pretty much stopped when we touched down gently and Rob liked that allot.

I received a nice email from Rob that evening that said: “Can’t thank you enough for my “first flight” in gyrocopter N142MG – it was an exciting and totally enjoyable experience for an old fixed wing pilot like me!”

I love being able to bring something unique and exciting into the life of someone who has had so much excitement and adventure in their lives.

Flying a gyroplane is a completely different experience then flying a fixed wing aircraft. Generally speaking we don’t care how high, how fast or how far.

Rob has indicated that he wants to move forward with getting trained for his Sport Pilot, Gyroplane add on rating. I suspect he will be quick study and a joy to teach.

27. Rob in his first minutes of flying The Predator at 1,300 feet with San Luis Obispo behind us.

28. An accidental picture out the left side toward the hills, sometimes the camera develops a mind of its own.

31. 1,300 feet MSL over California Highway 101 with the water tower at our one o’clock and the blowing dust in the distance.

34. Rob getting more comfortable with Avilla Bay over his right shoulder.
 

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Vance

Gyroplane CFI
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
Messages
15,876
Location
Nipomo,California
Aircraft
Givens Predator
Total Flight Time
2200+ in rotorcraft
Vance,
A good way to see how (if) your ADS-B Out is working is to request a performance report after your flight from the FAA at:
I did and there was no signal on Sunday.

John worked on cleaning up the grounds and we Went up on Wednesday morning and it worked perfectly.

I am excited to be ADS-B out compliant.

It wasn’t that hard or that expensive.

As is often the case I spent a lot of time and energy procrastinating.
 
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