Howdy all.

DaveJaksha

Gold Supporter
Joined
Feb 14, 2016
Messages
186
Location
Tucson
Aircraft
Sportcopter Vortex
Total Flight Time
100
Hi, Everybody.

Name is Dave and am just starting to consider getting into gyroplanes. I have my private pilots license, built a LongEze many years ago, but have not been flying for about 25 years.

Anyway, I have been really interested in the Sparrowhawk lll. I have sent a couple of emails to American Autogyro to get some additional info on the Sparrowhawk. However, no response from them. Are they still in business?

Thanks,

Dave
 
Dave, welcome to the forum!

Groen Brothers Aviation discontinued sales a few years ago, and has now been swallowed by a Chinese conglomerate. Your best bet on a SparrowHawk III is the used market.
 
Re: Howdy all

Re: Howdy all

Wow, thanks for the update Paul. Sure looks like they are open from the website. Wish that these companies that close up shop would take down or at least make a notice on the web page they are no longer in business.. Lots of wasted time chasing these things down.

Well, guess I need to look for a used or abandoned Sparrowhawk III project. Anyone have suggestions on the best way to try and find such a beast?

Thanks for any advice.

Dave
 
Hi Dave,

Welcome to the forum. What is it that makes you focus on the Sparrowhawk? Would you consider other gyro models ?

Steve
 
Re: Howdy all

Re: Howdy all

Hi, Steve.

I am retired now, and my wife and myself are spending about 8 months a year at a second home we have. We would like to make trips back and forth, but it's about a 7 hr drive. Seems like a good use of a plane. However, private aviation has gotten to where I cannot afford a something like a Cherokee, even a very old one.
So something that I can fly on mogas, do my own maintenance, and is safe to fly seems to be a good solution. I have never flown a gyroplane before, but have know some guys that flew them, and really like the fact they can get in and out of short runways, and can put down safely in case of an engine failure.

Besides knocking around the pattern, I am looking for a two place, ( preference for side by side) plane I can fly a 300 mile cross country trip. Something like a Cavalon or M-24 would be great, but they are also more than I can afford. So, after looking around the Sparrowhawk lll seemed to be a reasonably priced possibility. Although even the $48000 price for a 51% Sparrowhawk kit is pushing it. Also, the after reading a lot of threads here and other places the Sparowhawk lll seemed to have most of the problems worked out compared to the RAF2000 or early Sparrowhawks.

So that's my thoughts. I'm open to any suggestions or their gyros that may fill my requirements.

Cheers,

Dave
 
Don't think there are too many gyros that can make a 300 mile cross country in one hop. If you have to stop once for fuel, that adds an hour to the trip. Given the real world cruise speed of the Sparrowhawk, you won't shave much time off of your driving time. Like you I had not flown much for many years, so my first task was to get training. I opted to get my Sport Pilot Gyroplane endorsement, then took every opportunity to fly the gyros I was interested in. Only then can you tell which aircraft fits your needs and desires. I've attended the PRA convention at Mentone, which is probably the best place to quickly get time in a lot of different gyros. Best of luck.
 
Thanks for your comments Richard. Yes, I had planned on a fuel stop anyway. As I have aged my bladder has shrunk, so a break is welcome. Flying is certainly more fun than driving, right? When I had the Longeze, my wife was not a fan of the tandem seating, so side by side is a must. In the same vein, sitting inside a cockpit out of the wind is also important. So I kept zeroing in on the SparrowHawk as a machine that keeps us out of the elements but is still relatively cheap to operate.
By all means, training is at the top of the list.

Thanks to all for the warm reception on the list. I have enjoyed reading the many threads....

Cheers,
Dave
 
Welcome!

Welcome!

Hi Dave,

Welcome to the Forum!

Looks like you have carefully considered your wants, needs, and options. Good work! Final step now is to get some rides to put your theories to the test. :)

If you are interested in getting a real fast crash-course I'd recommend making the trek to Bensen Days in beautiful Wauchula Florida in late March. http://bensendays.us.com/

There will be Sparrowhawk IIIs there, and more importantly, there will be folks who have built, owned, and flown those and most every other type of gyro. There will probably be someone who would love to give you a ride in one. And, definitely rides available in several other types.

Round trip ticket is only $367 right now. Lots of guys will spend more than that on car/truck/camper gas!
https://skiplagged.com/flights/TUS/TPA/2016-03-30/2016-04-03

If you go, find the Peach State area and look us up. We have a couple of long-timers in the Club who are true Sparrowhawk experts.

M
 
Besides knocking around the pattern, I am looking for a two place, ( preference for side by side) plane I can fly a 300 mile cross country trip.

Dave, 300-mile trips might not be the best mission for the SparrowHawk. Like the RAF 2000 on which it's based, the seating position is bolt-upright, and they're pretty loud inside. Active noise reduction headsets help, and you'll certainly find people who've done it, but there are better machines for your mission, IMHO.

There are several clones of the MTO Sport being offered now by other kitmakers, although many are in early stages, and side-by-sides can be expected to follow. Given the strength of the Dollar against the Euro at the moment, there may be some good opportunities coming if you're patient.

A Cavalon is expensive as gyros go, but it would fly your mission in about four hours, probably without refueling unless you had a headwind. Something similar from another kitmaker when available, perhaps selecting a Yamaha engine over Rotax to save more than half the engine cost, might be a good path.
 
There may be some nice used machines available that may be closer to your price point. For me, the Sparrowhawk was not comfortable to get in and out of or to fly compared to some others. At this point, I have decided to get a fixed wing 2-place for cross country flights and look at single place gyros for fun local flying. That being said, I still lust for a 2-place gyro. For the record, I want tandem seating as my wife has not been bitten by the flying bug, so I won't be trying to outbid you in the used gyro market. Would love a Magni M-22... Or a Calidus... Or a Titanium Explorer... Or an AR-1...Or... In the end the easiest problem may be coming up with the extra money to buy the ship of your dreams. Good luck in your search.
 
I think that you should look for your self and decide,to me the sparow hawk is a big roomy

easy to get in and out of gyro and would be just fine on long trips. and there is nothing

wrong with the subaru 2.5 engine. there is a gyro instructor close to you at san manuel.

go out there and look around.





best regards,
 
Paul
Saying that a gyro is a "clone of an MTO" is a bit unfair on ELA from which the first MTOs were blatant copies. It suggests that AutoGyro (manufacturers of MTO) were the first to come up with that design when a lot of the credit for the first reliable 2seat Eurogyro should go to Magni.

Some might say that the ELA was a clone of the Magni but I would say that Emilio Albany (the father of ELA) designed a machine with enough different and original details to the Magni to say that it wasn't a clone. If you're going to design a two seat pusher tandem gyro with a Rotox 9XX engine it's going to look pretty much like a Magni.

Chuck will argue that they're all Bensens in party frocks and historically I suppose he's right.

Mike G
 
Great to see all the comments from everyone. I would love to go to the Bensdays flyin. Sounds really like a lot of fun, but I am not going to be able to get away now. I will keep in in mind for next time.
As for the comfort of the Sparrowhawk, I will have to wait and see for myself I guess. The larger Sparrowhawk lll cabin is what I am interested in. The extra width is necessary in my case since my butt is extra wide...

I will keep my eyes open for a project that someone is willing to give up on, or maybe a finished plane at a good price point. I really hope someone comes up with some alternatives that are coming into production.

The comment on noise is certainly appropriate. IT can fatigue you pretty quickly. I have found the Active noise reduction headphones work really well for me. They are like day and night with respect to stock headphones like David/Clarks. They knock down the low frequencies and still allow excellent communications.

Cheers,

Dave
 
I would also make sure the better half was involved in the decision before the wallet comes out. I just got my biennial flight review this morning in an Ercoupe, a plane I've long wanted to fly. Was a lot of fun, but tight and tough for these old knees getting up, in and out. One size definitely doesn't fit all. A friend of mine bought a used Magni M24 because the seats while side by side are also staggered for even more room.
 
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You and your wife should both take a ride in a tandem before you rule them out. With a good headset and intercom, its really not that bad and right now there are a lot of very good tandems on the market for just a little over what you are expecting to spend on a Sparrowhawk. It will be much easier finding training too.
 
Welcome

Welcome

Hi Dave,

My wife, Britta and I have a gyroplane training and sales business in San Manuel (30 miles north of Oro Valley) at the Ray Blair Airport - E77. We are training in an MTO, and can sell you an AutoGyro product, or we have several used Air Commands for sale.
My wife is the CFI, and her business is Blue Sky Gyros. You can call her about an appointment for an intro flight, if you are so interested.

We are at the airport most days, so give us a call. We love introducing people to gyroplanes.

Mark Rhoads - AutoGyro AZ -520-840-0186
Britta Penca - Blue Sky Gyros - 520-840-0186
 
Ron Menzie in Searcy AR

Ron Menzie in Searcy AR

Flys & trains in beautifully set up Sparrowhawks ...fitted with Sportrotors & trim system ... he'd be your go-to guy for top-of-the-line machines & training - IF you were firmly set on the 'hawk! He is doing more in the MTO ...which he loves ... but likes the full cabin gyro for winter flying!
Ron spends time in Arizona also & is associated with Britta & Mark ...all great folks & CFI's ..I'd highly recommend!

Ron has been selling off his surplus gyros recently ... who knows ... maybe he's ready to release one of his super S'hawks!
 
Hi, everyone.

Britta and Mark. I am out of the country currently but when I get back into Tucson I will give you guys a call and see if we can get together. Thanks for the invite.

I have another question maybe someone can help me with. I this pra.org still active? I have been over at the web page, and have tried to join with no luck. The process always returns a database error. Also, I have sent email to their contract on the site, but never get any response. Anyone have any info?


Cheers,

Dave
 
Hi Dave. Find the PRA forum on this site and post. I am sure it won't take long till one shows up here and replies.
 
I looked at the PRA site and the pay link seems to be working.

If are still having a problem send an e-mail to John Roundtree, [email protected], he has been handling many of the daily chores while Jane is out of the office.
 
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