Gyro Technic, Inc. Rotor Blades

gyrojake

Gyro Rehab Candidate
Joined
Jan 1, 2007
Messages
2,219
Location
E-City, Florida
Aircraft
Gyroplanes
Total Flight Time
A few hours

Attachments

Hueychief

FNG
Joined
Jan 30, 2012
Messages
46
Location
Hutchinson, MN
Aircraft
Sikorsky S-64/S-61, Harmon Rocket 3, Bell UH-1ST, FireFly 7-15 Balloon, Grob 103, MTO Sport Gyro
Total Flight Time
7,000+
Kolibri, please unlock your profile so I may know your real name. Thanks.
 

GyrOZprey

Aussie in Kansas.
Joined
Aug 8, 2011
Messages
2,958
Location
Whitewater KS
Aircraft
Butterfly Aurora N5560Z / Titanium Explorer N456TE & N488TE/ - trained in MTOsport 446QT/488FB
Total Flight Time
770
Kolibri, you seem to feel the need to pounce on and discredit anyone you feel competes with Sport Copter, and you're not shy about fabricating the reasons. If you're going to continue as a representative of Jim's company, I hope you find a way to bite your tongue when this impulse occurs, because you make Sport Copter look bad when you do it. I haven't seen anyone, let alone Denis, say his blades will be "superior" to Sport Copter's.

Those who've flown Sport Rotors and Dragon Wings know they perform differently, and each product has its strong points. Sport Rotors are easier to start and recover from lost RPM, stiffer, and I prefer the finish; Dragon Wings are in theory more efficient, significantly lighter, have traditionally been less costly in comparable sizes, and available with significantly shorter lead times. That doesn't make either of them "lacking," it simply provides the option to match the choice to the needs of the project. I picked up a new set of Sport Rotors for my Vortex in February, so I've evaluated these choices personally.

I admire Sport Copter's uncompromising quality and consider Jim a great friend, but it's always good to have more than one source for such a critical component. I also look forward to seeing how the new Skywheels blades perform now that Air Command has the tooling and will be producing them.

When I worked in electronic retail years ago, the most successful salesman I ever worked with taught me it's actually easier to sell a product in an A/B comparison than it is with no competition. The first situation allows positioning product benefits; a monopoly always leaves the major decision "do I really need this?"

I've seen the workmanship of both these guys up-close. I would trust either one of these rotors to be safer than any extruded or fiberglass blades I've seen.

WELL SAID PAUL!!!!!!
 

Kolibri

FW and Gyros
Joined
Oct 17, 2014
Messages
1,636
Location
Wyoming
Aircraft
Cessna 152, 172, 172RG, 177, 206 -- Piper 180 -- RV-7A -- Calidus -- RAF2000 -- Sport Copter II and
Total Flight Time
1000+
Sorry gyrojake, my mistake, it was "only" 52 steps, not 53:

Approximately 52 steps in producing a single set of rotorblades!
Thereafter follows a general description of what the Boeing spec entails, vs. a simple repair job with 3M tape.
Chemically dipped in three separate tanks, baked on primer prior to bonding, three bake cycles, etc., etc.
Figuring it all out took 36+ months.

You get what you pay for in this life, and, conversely, you don't get what you don't pay for.
Good luck to those who skimp.

____
There are many gyros -- lousy gyros, even -- nevertheless safely flying on the best blades made which were not original to the aircraft.
I'm very grateful to Jim Vanek and Sport Copter for that.

I was brought up to value and practice loyalty.
"Ya leave the dance with the one who brung ya."

Regards,
Kolibri out.
 
Last edited:

Gyro Technic

Manufacturer
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Messages
10
Location
Kasota, MN
Aircraft
Gyro Technic GTVX1
Two items have become very obvious to me.

1) I am very lucky to be part of such a wonderful group of people who are so supportive of me, and continually praise me for simply taking pride in, and doing no less than my best at what I love to do! It is heartwarming to feel that I have the support of so many with the exception of one (1) individual.

2)This large group of people seem to have a unanimous, shared opinion on the character of this one individual.

I have not disclosed anything about the team of people and advisers I am working with as I develop this product.

I understand I will certainly never have the abilities or expertise of somebody like Jim Vanek.
Regardless, there was a significant group of people in Indiana last year who thought I had at least a little bit of piloting "chops"
They decided to give me the center award last year. (attached)

I could gather all my other awards and take a picture to further build my "clout" but I have more important things to work on.

Back to designing / calibrating / testing / analyzing............

Thanks everybody!
Denis

1144941
 
Last edited:

Kolibri

FW and Gyros
Joined
Oct 17, 2014
Messages
1,636
Location
Wyoming
Aircraft
Cessna 152, 172, 172RG, 177, 206 -- Piper 180 -- RV-7A -- Calidus -- RAF2000 -- Sport Copter II and
Total Flight Time
1000+
Denis, you are rightly respected for your machining abilities, and I think your work looks very good.

If I am mistaken about your lack of gyro rating, or nonexistence of any "
partnership" with Sport Copter, then please correct me and I will post a sincere apology.

Regards,
Kolibri
 
Last edited:

twistair

Living in the Skies
Joined
Nov 24, 2003
Messages
1,161
Location
Kronshtadt, Russia
Aircraft
none own :( currently flying Calidus mostly
Total Flight Time
Don't know exactly, ca. 3000 hours
Dude you need an education.
I'm building a helicopter from scratch and I use the 3m Af 163 film to put my tail rotor together.
Some good stuff, even idiots like me can use it. I'll bet you can use it too, with success.
"Father, forgive them, for they don't know what they are doing." ~Luke 23:34 NLT :unsure:
Did you ever heard that this film storage and transportation must be at 0 deg. F temperature? Otherwise it loses most of its performance.
Did you ever heard that to bond aluminium parts they should be etched prior to bonding otherwise they didn't last long?

I wonder how well are you prepared to land your helicopter when its tail rotor fails. God bless..
 

gyrojake

Gyro Rehab Candidate
Joined
Jan 1, 2007
Messages
2,219
Location
E-City, Florida
Aircraft
Gyroplanes
Total Flight Time
A few hours
"Father, forgive them, for they don't know what they are doing." ~Luke 23:34 NLT :unsure:
Did you ever heard that this film storage and transportation must be at 0 deg. F temperature? Otherwise it loses most of its performance.
Did you ever heard that to bond aluminium parts they should be etched prior to bonding otherwise they didn't last long?

I wonder how well are you prepared to land your helicopter when its tail rotor fails. God bless..
So, what makes your all knowing self think that my film is not stored properly?
How do you know they were not etched prior to bonding?
How do yo know the chromate conversion was done after bonding?
To me you just proved you are a dumb ass and are not worthy to be on my posts !!!
 

twistair

Living in the Skies
Joined
Nov 24, 2003
Messages
1,161
Location
Kronshtadt, Russia
Aircraft
none own :( currently flying Calidus mostly
Total Flight Time
Don't know exactly, ca. 3000 hours
So, what makes your all knowing self think that my film is not stored properly?
Your photos tell much more than you can imagine.
To me you just proved you are a dumb ass and are not worthy to be on my posts!!!
Well, your reply shows that this thread isn't worth to waste your precious attention littering this thread .
 

SportCopter

Active Member
Joined
May 13, 2014
Messages
130
Location
Scappoose
Aircraft
Vortex M912, SportCopterII, Vortex 582
Sport Copter and GyroTechnic have not formed any kind of partnership. He was one of our signed NCA agreement Sport Rotors “Dealer” Customers. Every customer/dealer that purchases rotors signs a “Purchase Agreement”. We wish him well in his new business venture. We feel he is a master machinist. If his customers choose to upgrade/change from “Razor Blades” to Sport Rotors, we are always here to assist them. We hope everyone has a safe and Happy 4th! -Trenna
 

All_In

Gold Supporter
Joined
Apr 21, 2008
Messages
14,627
Location
San Diego, CA. USA
Aircraft
Piper Archer, Aviomania G1sb
Total Flight Time
Not sure over 10,000+ logged FW, 260+ ultralights, sailplane, hang-gliders
Sport Copter and GyroTechnic have not formed any kind of partnership. He was one of our signed NCA agreement Sport Rotors “Dealer” Customers. Every customer/dealer that purchases rotors signs a “Purchase Agreement”. We wish him well in his new business venture. We feel he is a master machinist. If his customers choose to upgrade/change from “Razor Blades” to Sport Rotors, we are always here to assist them. We hope everyone has a safe and Happy 4th! -Trenna
Trenna you and Jim are shining examples of the fair, kind, and good people that are in our community. I was very impressed with Jim soul when he expresses his true feelings. Not many take the high road.
I do agree with Kolibri that your blades are well time tested and one of the best in the world!!! As are all of Sport Copter's models, and products. We thank Jim, you, and Sport Copter for all you have done for YEARS for our rotorcraft community. You will continue to do well because your products are that good!

PS:
Some may know PRA is sponsoring education projects. I was just talking to Jim about projects for a seat to absorb impact. He gave me his solution and I discovered he's been using NASA foam for years in his seats. Jim's tells me all about it but it very expensive. Scratch the seat project Jim gave PRA his solution for free. Thanks to Jim PRA will enquire into a volume purchase discount. If we can save enough we will buy it and hold it in inventory and make it a little more affordable to our community.
 

Gyro Technic

Manufacturer
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Messages
10
Location
Kasota, MN
Aircraft
Gyro Technic GTVX1
Sport Copter and GyroTechnic have not formed any kind of partnership. He was one of our signed NCA agreement Sport Rotors “Dealer” Customers. Every customer/dealer that purchases rotors signs a “Purchase Agreement”. We wish him well in his new business venture. We feel he is a master machinist. If his customers choose to upgrade/change from “Razor Blades” to Sport Rotors, we are always here to assist them. We hope everyone has a safe and Happy 4th! -Trenna
Trenna,
Thank you for the clarification to everyone.
I am deeply sorry that I used the wrong terminology when describing my dealership status with Sport Copter.
It certainly was not my intent to mislead anyone.
On my web page, I have my "Partners" listed with links for Sport Copter, Power Fin, Leading Edge Airfoils, MGL, Aircraft Spruce......
I suppose I could change the heading to "Dealer for:" but I think the "Partner" statement is pretty common practice...

I am hopeful that sales of my gyro kits will continue to grow. With each sale there are quite a few "option" choices that each customer can choose from.
One of the options is certainly the customer's choice of rotor blades.
I would certainly expect that a very large percentage of my customers will decide to go with the Sport Rotors option due to their stellar reputation!

I am really looking forward to my continued DEALERSHIP with Sport Copter!

I see this as a win-win for everybody! I get the added clout of being able to market such a reputable product such as Sport Rotors, and I will be able to send some business back to Sport Copter as I can deliver their product with a bunch of my kits!

It appears to me that the 2 parties involved (Sport Copter and Gyro Technic) are the ones that have the least amount of issues with the situation!

Again, I apologize for any confusion, and I too, wish everyone a fun and safe holiday weekend!

Denis
 
Last edited:

GyrOZprey

Aussie in Kansas.
Joined
Aug 8, 2011
Messages
2,958
Location
Whitewater KS
Aircraft
Butterfly Aurora N5560Z / Titanium Explorer N456TE & N488TE/ - trained in MTOsport 446QT/488FB
Total Flight Time
770
Denis is a CLASS ACT & a genuinely super fellow! It is SO refreshing to have someone of his calibre character & fine machining skills filling a much needed niche in the gyro production community!

If it was 2011/2012 ....again - when I started my gyro kit building/ flight training & needed a machine to build solo hours ...... I would choose his entry level single place kit ....absolutely hands-down!
 
Last edited:

Gyro Technic

Manufacturer
Joined
Jan 4, 2018
Messages
10
Location
Kasota, MN
Aircraft
Gyro Technic GTVX1
Here in the UK a manufacturer had issues with 3m adhesive View attachment 1144948
Brian,
That is inexcusable! I see a total lack of any type of process control! Etching, priming, curing......
Did they wax the parts prior to trying to bond them?!?!
Not the fault of the 3M product!

Edit added...
After further viewing the photo, the top edges of the film show no sign of being "melted" what-so-ever
I don't think this part when through a curing cycle at all!
It's a heat-set epoxy..... Not double-sided tape!
 
Last edited:

twistair

Living in the Skies
Joined
Nov 24, 2003
Messages
1,161
Location
Kronshtadt, Russia
Aircraft
none own :( currently flying Calidus mostly
Total Flight Time
Don't know exactly, ca. 3000 hours
Here in the UK a manufacturer had issues with 3m adhesive
I'd rather say that it was a 3M adhesive which had issues with this manufacturer =)

Could you tell us a bit more about this attempt, Brian? I never heard that somebody in the UK tried to build metal rotors. I also wonder how this could pass through the UK CAA which probably is even more sluggish than our Russian is.
 

Brian P

Newbie
Joined
Jun 10, 2019
Messages
19
Location
Nottingham UK
Not sure of the full story. Rotordyne copies. Don't think the authorities knew about much. However the pilot test flying the machine encountered uncontrollable vibrations and was lucky to save the gyro. I've read that leading edge Unbonding on Rotordynes is not catastrophic....this could have been if it had occurred at altitude. There was also a reported trailing edge separation of a set of DW''s. ...using same adhesive.
 

C. Beaty

Gold Supporter
Joined
Apr 16, 2004
Messages
9,718
Location
Florida
Aluminum’s affinity for atmospheric oxygen makes it a difficult material to bond; even paint doesn’t adhere very well unless the surface is properly prepared. Freshly machined aluminum oxidizes almost instantly upon exposure to air and the oxide thus formed is a bit like dandruff; flakes off easily.

Most anyone who has tried to solder aluminum has given up in disgust but it can be done by creating a puddle of molten solder and scrubbing through the solder puddle with a stainless steel brush; the solder puddle excludes atmospheric oxygen while the oxide is scrubbed away.

Chromic acid treatment creates a chromate surface that prevents oxidation and provides an excellent surface for structural bonding. Unfortunately, chromic acid is a toxic material and government regulations have increasingly restricted availability.

One part epoxy structural films must be stored in a freezer until use and require elevated temperatures for curing. My company used FM-1000 film made by a division of American Cyanamid before they went belly up. This was for military contracts but the cure temperature of 350F was a bit too high for heat treated aluminum alloys such as 2024 and 7075.
 
Top