DRUGS & ALCOHOL what do you think?

Silverwing

PATRIOT
Joined
Feb 27, 2005
Messages
114
Location
Medford, OK USA
Aircraft
C150/150,C172,P160,180,B-A23
Total Flight Time
75+ Logged, 100's Not Logged
Hey all,

Simple question.

Would you RAT on someone who instructs, or flys, with passengers, drunk, or on dope?

_________________________________________________________________

I had a comment recently, saying "we might want to watch what we say around Silverwing". I think

that.............(hold my tounge) :mad: very :mad:

_________________________________________________________________

PLEASE coment here. So I know who to keep away from !


John.. "up, by myself,with the Eagles"
 
I don't care for the term "Rat" but I would do everything I could to stop them and that includes reporting them to the FAA. The reaction to ther report or not thread is part of why Gyros are not respected by most ofther forms of aviation. It is my opinion that flying is a privalege and if we continue to support iresponsible behavior we may well lose that privalege. It does not apear that alcohol is a major factor in most gyro fatalities, but it does seem like such a pointless added risk to an already risky activity. We are making progress with the FAA and light sport, lets not let a few iresponsible people ruin it for us all. Thank you, Vance
 
I heard that you were bringing ALL the beer for BD's. But I can't say who said it. :rolleyes:
 
Vance,

I'm glad to hear that from you.

Your a good egg. :D

John
 
it shoudn't be tolorated... If I have even 1 beer, I (and wife) ground me until 12 hours later!!! NO EXCEPTIONS.
 
Silverwing see other post. I saw that point and I didn't like it either. This kind of attitude is common in the gyro world apparently, even though it is definately is not exclusive. I will stand up for you !

Vance - excellent post !
 
Hello Chris, I didn't know that I was suposed to bring all the beer, how much should I bring and who pays for it? Thank you, vance
 
Alcohol and drugs have already taken such a big toll on our highways. Why shift the carnage to the air. One of my friends is a State Trooper who investigates all the traffic fatalities in our area. I've heard way too many tragic stories involving drunk or impaired drivers. The last thing I want to see is intoxicated or impaired flyers.
 
I heard that you were buying, Don't let us down!
 
Chris, I am afraid that as an older retired person I am not able to purchase that much beer, so you need to find someone else to take on that particular task. Besides, I have an alergic reaction to alcohol, I break out in felonys. Sorry to let you down, Vance
 
Hello Ron, I belong to EAA chapter 499, chapter 1000 and chapter 1. I belong to AOPA. I belong to Tha Santa Maria, San Diego and Liberal air museums. I am often at the Airport on Sundays. I agee that people act badly.

Didn't your mother ever ask you about jumping off the cliff just because everybody else is?

Life is a series of challenges and how we respond to them has a lot to do with our quality of life.

Thank you, Vance
 
Silverwing, the discussion in the other thread was not about drugs or flying drunk. That was just a example used!!!!

What do I have to say to make you and James McBirdman READ my posts? :mad:

I AGREE DRUGS AND BOOZE AND FLYING ARE A BIG NO NO!

I DO NOT CONSIDER SOMEONE WHO CALLS IN A DRUNK PILOT A RAT NOR DO I CONSIDER IT BAD IN ANYWAY TO REPORT A PERSON THAT IS FLYING ON DRUGS!!!

Silver Wing your posts in the other thread came clearly across that you were the type of person that could not and would not stop from reporting any breaking of any rules. Go back and read what you posted if I am taking it the wrong way. THAT is my point to you, that I think if it is not SAFETY related but is a breaking of a rule that it isn't the end of the dam world and no need to go cause a person trouble with the FAA over flying a overweight ultralight or some other harmless violation. Am I just reading more into your comments than I should?

Look I am not saying rules are for losers and we should all be rebel flyers and break ever rule in the book. I know rules are normally for the good and they should be followed.



James, Vance.... you need to get to know your GA airplane scence a little better. I have seen more illegal crap in my local General Aviation Scence than all the gyroplane and gyro people I have ever come across.
 
vance said:
Hello Ron, I belong to EAA chapter 499, chapter 1000 and chapter 1. I belong to AOPA. I belong to Tha Santa Maria, San Diego and Liberal air museums. I am often at the Airport on Sundays. I agee that people act badly.

Didn't your mother ever ask you about jumping off the cliff just because everybody else is?

Life is a series of challenges and how we respond to them has a lot to do with our quality of life.

Thank you, Vance

So you do see a fair share of " violations" at the airport from time to time. My whole entire point in these two threads is for some of those violations there is a responsibility to report a wrongdoer, other times it is better to let life go on and to mind your own business.

Hey Vance, mommy told me about the jumping off a cliff thing more than once!

She also told me that what goes around, comes around...... That is why I have never reported no one. I don't need that coming back to bite me in the ass! :)
 
Ron says " Flying drunk is one thing that is major, that deserves serious attention. But I think that PT is talking about other stuff as well... Such as knowing someone is flying with a expired medical, or someone is flying with a aircraft you feel is not airworthy, or is flying in a style or manner you feel is out of control or dangerous... among other things...

He then says "What do I have to say to make you and James McBirdman READ my posts? "

I do read your posts and it infers that you do believe about the drinking BUT PTKAY is talking about those other realitively other minor things that don't really matter that much........ In short to me it sounds like you are saying you do believe the drink/fly bad BUT less important such as ....... not anyones business.......

Just because everyone you hang out with or see does it - doesn't mean that it happens everywhere. I am not sure what you mean about questioning my aviation sense.... It is pretty clear that there is a right way to do things and a wrong way. I understand what you mean about being nitpicky but I don't think including expired or refused medicals or bad habits that hinder safety standards as something you would classify as being mean. The main pursuit is safety for everyone involved. It is like being too concerned about insulting someone that has no business doing what they are doing which could in fact hurt people that are playing by the rules.

I read his post and I got what he was saying but I wouldn't say hey watch out for him he is a tattle tale...... I look at it that I am approachable and correctable especially if I deserve it or am doing something unfair to others. If I do not take action to modify the situation - then those people don't have to keep being inconvienced ....

But the bottom line is that I don't care how many people think it is okay to break the law and rules. I am sorry but medical and current profficiency requirements do enter the catagory of safety. How would you feel about someone hopping into a plane with passengers and know they haven't landed once by themselves for 4.5 years? You wouldn't think or say anything to the pilot? Who's business is it if we are all actually watching out for each other? To make it realitively simple - easier to speak up now before they fly and risk someone getting mad but maybe being able to consider a point being made than to watch someone herd 3 other people into the plane knowing full well that things are going to get interesting. Should anything happen you will live with the knowledge that you let an opportunity pass. That is all I mean if that makes more GA sense.
 
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I've been a little discouraged at times to see older pilots, mostly fixed-wingers, be very casual about flying after a couple beers. These are the same guys who think radios are for sissies. It's as if they learned to fly in an era when there weren't many aircraft around, and haven't noticed that now, there are.

Reporting someone is a tough thing to do, but finding out later you could have prevented a death or injury, and didn't, would be tougher. If someone is willing to risk the lives of those around him, including mine, I could quickly lose any inhibition about turning him in.
 
Gyroron,
When I say "don't turn a blind eye", and "if you don't say something, your just as guilty"....... That's like comparing, someone shoplifting in a store, to littering in the store.

I've called the tower many of times to turn around an aircraft, because... the pilot/CFII, thought he was good to go, but he's getting ready to trash my inheritence.
What do you think about a stock Cessna 172, with high engine times, 4 souls on board, beyond gross wieght, in 110 degree Desert heat? Sometimes you gotta do what ya gotta do.

I think you may have taken it a little different than I meant. I was talking about Drugs/Alcohol, and even stated so.

I don'y sweat the petty things, and don't pet the sweaty things. (George Carlin)

I could care less if it has a weight problem, or too much gas... How would I know what you got? I don't own it. I don't care....

Drugs/Alcohol... NOW you got my attention.


John
 
Minor things

Minor things

Over here we are meant to report bird strikes (including near misses), and if that were to be the practical case ,one of our local air spray companies would be foreever grounded. When you look at the leading edges of their aircraft you'd notice all these dents like as if someone had taken to it with a golf club. Winter time and ducks are a continual problem for night spraying. I'd hate to think of the mess after having one go through a prop

No one here is suggesting that they be reported for such a minor issue, after all they do the season and then repair. What the main players here are suggesting is that if there was a major breech then yes they would seriously consider reporting.

And I thnk that appropriate.
Ted
 
The bottom line on all of this is common sense...
If you don't use it then the Gov't makes rules demanding you do. Ever wonder why some of the laws seem so nit picky and strange? It's because they have to be, otherwise someone will find a way to circumvent them. If someone is impaired and they decide to fly then they deserve what ever happens to them. (it's the way the gene pool keeps out the idiots :D )
But they DO NOT have a right to endanger others.
The Sport Pilot regs are not meant to allow someone who can't get a legal medical to fly. They are to reduce the costs involved.
If I see someone drinking and then getting in a plane, damn sure I'll try and stop them, and if I can't then I'll drop a dime on them. It'd suck to see some fool get in a plane and take out someone who has nothing to do with it.
If you get in a plane with someone who is impaired then you are only helping to cleanse the gene pool yourself.
If we used common sense then we wouldn't need uncle Sam or anyone else telling us when and how, sadly that is not the case...
 
mcbirdman said:
But the bottom line is that I don't care how many people think it is okay to break the law and rules. I am sorry but medical and current profficiency requirements do enter the catagory of safety. How would you feel about someone hopping into a plane with passengers and know they haven't landed once by themselves for 4.5 years? You wouldn't think or say anything to the pilot? Who's business is it if we are all actually watching out for each other? To make it realitively simple - easier to speak up now before they fly and risk someone getting mad but maybe being able to consider a point being made than to watch someone herd 3 other people into the plane knowing full well that things are going to get interesting. Should anything happen you will live with the knowledge that you let an opportunity pass. That is all I mean if that makes more GA sense.

James I highlighted a part of your post. Your post leads me to believe your talking about going up to this pilot and warning him not to fly till he is current. This whole ranting of mine is because others here say they should report the guy to the FAA.

Get the FAA involved and it becomes serious business. It can cost a guy thousands upon thousands in fines and legal fees.

Once more I say you guys are TOTALLY MISSING MY POINT.

HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY IT..... It is okay to and highly encouraged in my opinion, to go out of your way to warn, scold, yell, preach to..... And if there is still a problem..... REPORT their butt to the FAA IF THE ISSUE IS A SAFETY ISSUE!

Flying 3 of your buddies when you haven't flown in 4.5 years is clearly a safety risk. Flying while on a LSD trip is clearly a safety risk. Flying with known medical conditions is clearly a safety risk.

Ah.... but what about flying on a expired medical...? Well here is where you and I might differ. If I know the pilot, and I KNOW that he is in great physical shape and has no health problems, and he is a month behind on going to the doctor, Well if I see the guy flying I am not going to haul ass to the phone to report the guy to the local Fsdo. The Faa says you can fly without a medical in sport pilot, so I don't see it being a huge safety concern if Johnny Pilot is out on a day VFR flight with his Wife in a Cessna 152 with a expired medical, UNLESS I know johnny has a health problem.

But again, I am not saying you should turn away from known safety issues. If a rule is being broken that you feel can lead to a crash or incident, it IS your duty to go to the person and try to talk some sence into him or her and if nothig positive changes go and report them. If it is a major safety issue such as flying drunk maybe you should just go and report them immediatly. But....

Again for another example, what if you know someone at your airport that is about to fly a plane that is a month late for annual, but it otherwise in perfectly good airworthy shape? Should we rush to the phone to call the FSDO? Or is it not really important enough to put the poor guy in the hotseat just yet... maybe we should wait till after we have talked to the guy or at least wait till the annual is really out of date?

What if you notice a non A&P doing work on his or her certified airplane? Again, from experience I can tell you that at least in the Charlotte area, the local Flight schools planes are IMHO piles of junk that are falling apart. I see everyone and their brother turning wrenches on these planes. That bothers me, because I know that people who don't see that stuff are renting these planes and assuming the maintance is all performed by some super mechanic and their safety is assured. It hasn't bothered me to the point of calling the Fsdo, but I have made comments to the ones with tools in their hands.

But how you would feel about a private pilot that owns say a Cessna 172 and you know he replaced the carb, or the starter or some other bolt on item without a A&P sign off? You know some people have enough mechanical skill to do such a demanding task as replacing the starter, and I don't see it as a big deal if they didn't go to their mechanic for a signoff. I don't see that as a safety issue, unless I know the guy tightened the bolts with a pair of pliers or something else that tells me the guy may have not installed the starter properly.

you see my point is there are some things that really should be reported and other things that may be breaking a rule but aren't nearly as important and IMHO not important enough to have you go out of your way to hot the guy in the hot seat.

Getting passed by a Drunk on the highway you SHOULD follow the guy and call 911. Getting passed by some yahoo going 150 mph down the interstate, if you got his tag number go ahead and call it in.

But should you sit on a street corner all day writing down tag numbers of every person who didn't have his seatbelt on? who turned right without using the blinker? whose inspection sticker is expired? etc??? No I don't think so, that if for the police to handle, let the police do their job.
 
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