- Joined
- Oct 30, 2003
- Messages
- 18,357
- Location
- Santa Maria, California
- Aircraft
- Givens Predator
- Total Flight Time
- 2600+ in rotorcraft
From Kolibri's post 71.
"I see two different forms of "insurance" when landing during turbulence:
1) Drop in mostly vertically from the classic 20' roundout/initial flare but with maybe a bit more power for rudder authority.
(RISK: pancaking in below 5-10 feet from loss of lift and/or downdraft.)
2) Fly through mostly horizontally after a within-rotorwash roundout, flying at 1-2 feet to the full-flare landing.
(RISK: being involuntarily set down by a strong downdraft with a-higher-than-desired-though-not-necessarily-unsafe groundspeed,)
As I and others see it, #2 shortens the amount of time in a block of turbulence, and reduces the vertical impact component.
During either technique, one must pass through what I consider the vulnerable altitude of 3-10 feet.
I'd rather pass through that with more speed and lower to the deck than technique #1."
Rotor wash: air turbulence caused by a helicopter rotor.
Perhaps Kolibri is writing about ground effect.
The Principals of ground effect according to Wikipedia:
When an aircraft flies at a ground level approximately at or below the half length of the aircraft's wingspan or helicopter's rotor diameter, there occurs, depending on airfoil and aircraft design, an often noticeable ground effect.
So a gyroplane with a thirty foot diameter rotor that is ten feet in the air needs to be less than five feet above the ground to experience ground effect.
In my opinion fling a gyroplane less than five feet above the ground at fifty to sixty knots is dangerous and pointless.
There is a third option; round out at fifteen feet and land normally with a little more power to enhance rudder authority.
In my opinion based on my experience flying in strong gusting winds; Kolibri’s method is dangerous and relies on a consistency of conditions that simply don't exist anywhere I fly.
I have clients try something approaching the Kolibri method in calm winds and quickly abandon it the first time they fly in strong (15kts to 25kts) gusting winds.
Kolibri's fantasies about the wind and how it affects a gyroplane during a landing are unrelated to what I experience flying in California, Arizona, Utah, Indiana, Wisconsin and Florida.
I don't understand why a low time gyroplane pilot imagines that they have thought about it enough to invent a new way of landing a gyroplane in strong gusting winds that is safer without trying it.
I am confident that Kolibri does not have the skill set to land as he describes.
Try flying the length of the runway at 60kts indicated air speed 50 feet above the ground in strong gusting winds and I suspect you will discover why it is a bad idea to fly at 60kts indicated air speed five feet above the ground.
"I see two different forms of "insurance" when landing during turbulence:
1) Drop in mostly vertically from the classic 20' roundout/initial flare but with maybe a bit more power for rudder authority.
(RISK: pancaking in below 5-10 feet from loss of lift and/or downdraft.)
2) Fly through mostly horizontally after a within-rotorwash roundout, flying at 1-2 feet to the full-flare landing.
(RISK: being involuntarily set down by a strong downdraft with a-higher-than-desired-though-not-necessarily-unsafe groundspeed,)
As I and others see it, #2 shortens the amount of time in a block of turbulence, and reduces the vertical impact component.
During either technique, one must pass through what I consider the vulnerable altitude of 3-10 feet.
I'd rather pass through that with more speed and lower to the deck than technique #1."
Rotor wash: air turbulence caused by a helicopter rotor.
Perhaps Kolibri is writing about ground effect.
The Principals of ground effect according to Wikipedia:
When an aircraft flies at a ground level approximately at or below the half length of the aircraft's wingspan or helicopter's rotor diameter, there occurs, depending on airfoil and aircraft design, an often noticeable ground effect.
So a gyroplane with a thirty foot diameter rotor that is ten feet in the air needs to be less than five feet above the ground to experience ground effect.
In my opinion fling a gyroplane less than five feet above the ground at fifty to sixty knots is dangerous and pointless.
There is a third option; round out at fifteen feet and land normally with a little more power to enhance rudder authority.
In my opinion based on my experience flying in strong gusting winds; Kolibri’s method is dangerous and relies on a consistency of conditions that simply don't exist anywhere I fly.
I have clients try something approaching the Kolibri method in calm winds and quickly abandon it the first time they fly in strong (15kts to 25kts) gusting winds.
Kolibri's fantasies about the wind and how it affects a gyroplane during a landing are unrelated to what I experience flying in California, Arizona, Utah, Indiana, Wisconsin and Florida.
I don't understand why a low time gyroplane pilot imagines that they have thought about it enough to invent a new way of landing a gyroplane in strong gusting winds that is safer without trying it.
I am confident that Kolibri does not have the skill set to land as he describes.
Try flying the length of the runway at 60kts indicated air speed 50 feet above the ground in strong gusting winds and I suspect you will discover why it is a bad idea to fly at 60kts indicated air speed five feet above the ground.