Accident prevention with the Gyro Warning System (GWS)

High praise from Waspy,Mike and Jim!
I am honored.
Querist, I installed a stall warning on my gyro and even after I removed the wad of chewing gum it won't go off....
It may be broken
 
I always reread my posts after I send them. If I notice anything awry, I fix it.
I don't think I've ever noticed any ham or awry in your postings.

Maybe if I'm fortunate enough to meet you someday I'll learn more.

Jim
 
I don't think I've ever noticed any ham or awry in your postings.

Maybe if I'm fortunate enough to meet you someday I'll learn more.

Jim

ham ... Tyger puts lots of ham all over in his sandwiches
 
Last edited:
I'm sure I'm "preaching to the choir" here, but that is simply broken. This is what happens when the legal system is designed by the people who profit from it the most.
Yes exactly. We should be like every other country and make the looser pay. That would eliminate ambulance chasers. We all know why a shark won’t bite a lawyer. Professional courtesy.
 
It would also mean a little guy could never sue a big company. Suppose you sue General Motors and they put a team of twenty five lawyers from an expensive firm on the case and beat you, meanwhile having run up a seven figure fee bill (believe me, they will, if only to scare off others) so that you now have to pay that fee. Nobody can take risks like that. Pay your own way, the so-called American Rule, has some drawbacks for sure but it preserves access to the courts for the non-wealthy.
 
It would also mean a little guy could never sue a big company. Suppose you sue General Motors and they put a team of twenty five lawyers from an expensive firm on the case and beat you, meanwhile having run up a seven figure fee bill (believe me, they will, if only to scare off others) so that you now have to pay that fee. Nobody can take risks like that. Pay your own way, the so-called American Rule, has some drawbacks for sure but it preserves access to the courts for the non-wealthy.

Some drawbacks. You got to be kidding. It is a ridiculous system that encourages frivolous lawsuits. Most of rest of the world follows the loser pays system. That means you better have a reasonable case for a lawyer to file and if not, you don't. The way it should be.
 
Some drawbacks. You got to be kidding. It is a ridiculous system that encourages frivolous lawsuits. Most of rest of the world follows the loser pays system. That means you better have a reasonable case for a lawyer to file and if not, you don't. The way it should be.
In the US the loser, if the plaintiff, can be forced to pay if the judge determines that it is a frivolous suit.
 
In the US the loser, if the plaintiff, can be forced to pay if the judge determines that it is a frivolous suit.
Yes but that is hardly the norm
 
Frivolous suits are more common in popular mythology than in reality. In Federal court, there is a rule subjecting the attorney to severe discipline if s/he has not investigated the legal and factual grounds before filing. In all courts, motions to dismiss prevent empty claims from ever getting to trial. The cases that make it to the jury are, by definition, not frivolous, even if the public/press don't like the result. Many of the claims that shock people are shocking because the press fails to explain critical details.

The average guy could never take the risk of suing anybody if we did not have the rule. The "loser pays" alternative is great protection for the rich and a huge barrier to the rest. The courts belong to all of us, not just the wealthy, and everybody deserves access.
 
Frivolous suits are more common in popular mythology than in reality. In Federal court, there is a rule subjecting the attorney to severe discipline if s/he has not investigated the legal and factual grounds before filing. In all courts, motions to dismiss prevent empty claims from ever getting to trial. The cases that make it to the jury are, by definition, not frivolous, even if the public/press don't like the result. Many of the claims that shock people are shocking because the press fails to explain critical details.

The average guy could never take the risk of suing anybody if we did not have the rule. The "loser pays" alternative is great protection for the rich and a huge barrier to the rest. The courts belong to all of us, not just the wealthy, and everybody deserves access.
First time I have ever heard a concise argument for the way we do it. thank you.
 
Frivolous suits are more common in popular mythology than in reality. In Federal court, there is a rule subjecting the attorney to severe discipline if s/he has not investigated the legal and factual grounds before filing. In all courts, motions to dismiss prevent empty claims from ever getting to trial. The cases that make it to the jury are, by definition, not frivolous, even if the public/press don't like the result. Many of the claims that shock people are shocking because the press fails to explain critical details.

The average guy could never take the risk of suing anybody if we did not have the rule. The "loser pays" alternative is great protection for the rich and a huge barrier to the rest. The courts belong to all of us, not just the wealthy, and everybody deserves access.
My issue with the way we do it is these ambulance chasers that convince someone they are hurt in a minor fender bender. My Fiancé was in an accident where she pulled in front of someone at the approach of a traffic light that was red. The girl that hit her said oh I saw you hesitate three times then pull out. I said and you still hit her? Why wouldn’t you slow down and stop to avoid someone who obviously from your own admission was having a hard time seeing. She said I don’t know. We exchanged insurance info left the area she later called the city cops. They came to my house outside city limits and gave my girl a ticket 3 hours after the accident. Then a week later we get a notice they are claiming injuries and suing me. Good thing the store we exchanged insurance info has cameras. I’m sure they will clearly show them out of the car bending over taking pictures of the damage with no injury whatsoever ever. Until they saw that Morgan and a Morgan advertisement. Looser should pay in this instance.
 
First time I have ever heard a concise argument for the way we do it. thank you.
It is rather self-serving for a lawyer to want to maintain the 'status quo'.

Since the crux of the defense of the current system was "cost", why don't we attack THAT problem? Wouldn't that make sense (to a non-lawyer)?
For example, why should lawyers be paid 2X, 3X, 4X+ more than other Americans ?
Why should the lawyer be awarded such a huge percentage of any award?
Oh sure, I'll hear "education costs money, so lawyers have to charge you out the south end" and that they "invest soooo much time doing research", but MANY professions require some form of long-term, costly education and those professions don't pay at such an exorbitant rate.
A lot of people work a lot harder for a lot less money.
There is the disparity in the system.

So, lower the cost of "justice" and it thus becomes more affordable to the "average man" (you gals, too) and 'Loser Pays'.
If it wasn't so lucrative, we wouldn't have so many ambulance-chasers.
Seems like a 'win-win' to me !
 
What’s really funny is the only reason the profession was because most common people couldn’t read. The first ones were just educated people helping uneducated people out. Once the majority of people could read they found another way to make themselves not obsolete. Instead of writing the laws (most of congress, both houses, are lawyers) in American English so the average person could understand them they write them so that they are the only ones who can understand them. Thus perpetuating the need for their overpriced services. This in direct opposition to the founding fathers vision for our country.

It’s funny if you go to a courthouse for a few days in a row you will see it’s a racquet. They are all in it together. They are all friends. They go out for drinks together with the opposition and the cops. The only way anyone has a chance to not get screwed by the system is if they have enough money. Two systems that need to be reformed in this country is the Medical and the judicial systems.
 
Frivolous suits are more common in popular mythology than in reality. In Federal court, there is a rule subjecting the attorney to severe discipline if s/he has not investigated the legal and factual grounds before filing. In all courts, motions to dismiss prevent empty claims from ever getting to trial. The cases that make it to the jury are, by definition, not frivolous, even if the public/press don't like the result. Many of the claims that shock people are shocking because the press fails to explain critical details.

The average guy could never take the risk of suing anybody if we did not have the rule. The "loser pays" alternative is great protection for the rich and a huge barrier to the rest. The courts belong to all of us, not just the wealthy, and everybody deserves access.

That is not true in my experience. Most recent example was an employee of a maintenance organization next to us who decided to fly with a customer in the customer's RV-7 on a weekend from panhandle to Zephyrhills. The wings came off because it turned out the customer had taken upon himself to change the bolts from recommended AN bolts to stainless steel bolts.
The maintenance business got sued for nothing. They did not allow the employee to go fly with the guy. Had nothing to do with the event. It cost them $50k to get out of it. Complete utter rubbish just because someone worked there and did something on his off time that ended up in a tragedy
 
I’ve just driven back from Italy and am happy to report that the first production GWS to be installed and operating in a customer gyro was successfully installed at the Claudio Pagotto works in Italy.


Claudio makes the Brako line of gyros that includes the Blazer


and single seat Sprint


We installed the GWS in Gianluca Rossi’s flying school (ALLFLY) Brako gyro.


This was the first time we’d installed one in a Brako so it took a day and a half to get the wiring done and make a neat installation.


We then made the necessary calibration flights and a few hiccups (by me) the system was up and running.

Both Claudio and Gianluca said they were impressed and delighted by the system and felt it should reduce the number of accidents.


It will be interesting to get feedback from Gianluca as an instructor and from his students.

Hopefully soon Abid will install a GWS in one of his gyros and that the other manufacturers will show some interest.

Mike G
 
I’ve just driven back from Italy and am happy to report that the first production GWS to be installed and operating in a customer gyro was successfully installed at the Claudio Pagotto works in Italy.


Claudio makes the Brako line of gyros that includes the Blazer


and single seat Sprint


We installed the GWS in Gianluca Rossi’s flying school (ALLFLY) Brako gyro.


This was the first time we’d installed one in a Brako so it took a day and a half to get the wiring done and make a neat installation.


We then made the necessary calibration flights and a few hiccups (by me) the system was up and running.

Both Claudio and Gianluca said they were impressed and delighted by the system and felt it should reduce the number of accidents.


It will be interesting to get feedback from Gianluca as an instructor and from his students.

Hopefully soon Abid will install a GWS in one of his gyros and that the other manufacturers will show some interest.

Mike G
All good, and I genuinely applaud you guys.

But let no-one lose sight of the BIG KILLER of gyro pilots...

 
TyroGyro.
Agreed.
I wouldn't expect the GWS to have a noticeable impact on fatalities. I think that it has the potential to have an important impact on take-off accidents that are usually not fatal. Bunting accidents are fairly rare today so the warning will probably be more of a heads up that you're pushing the stick a bit to hard. It might have an impact on low slow flights leading to behind the curve flight into the ground and that might save someone but looking at most of the fatal accident reports I don't see many cases where the GWS could have saved the pilot.
Mike G
 
I'm currently finishing up a Gyro Technic GT-VX2. What would be involved in installing the GWS?
 
Loren
The GWS is currently only available to gyro manufacturers. That's because it needs to be wired into the gyro electrical and radio/intercom system and the GWS internal ASI has to be calibrated for the pitot/static installation of each gyro model. That usually requires me to assist the manufacturer and train him to setup and configure the GWS. A secondary reason is that in some countries the owner/pilot is not allowed to modify his gyro.
So you'll have to talk to Denis and ask him if he's interested in installing the GWS in his gyros, it would be an investment for him and probably too expensive for a one off.
Mike G
 
Top