A word of caution

[blacktail]

When I purchased my used machine I knew I would have to go through it throughly and made my offer based on several grand in updates, it had an annual done when it was sold previously and hadn't flown since according to the logs. I could see when I bought it that that rod knuckles were bent because of improper installation and that the RAF updates were not done, as I read through the annual inspection, every where it said replace the inspector had written inspected instead of replaced. At the end was Dofin Fritts name, a little Google search and my conclusion is that if you see his initials or name assume that any repairs or inspections were not actually done.
Sincerely Jason

 

[Vance]

I have a client who purchased a modified RAF with seven years of annual condition inspections that had extensive problems that indicated the annual condition inspections were not done correctly.

I will not fly in a customer’s aircraft until an A&P mechanic I trust has inspected the aircraft.

A trouble with any used experimental amateur built aircraft is it was built by an amateur who may have had some gaps in their skill set.

Since then each person who worked on it likely had their own gaps in their skill sets.

Be prepared to go through the aircraft very carefully before it may be considered airworthy and be prepared to hire the skill sets you are weak on.

 

[j4flyer]

When I purchased my used machine I knew I would have to go through it throughly and made my offer based on several grand in updates, it had an annual done when it was sold previously and hadn't flown since according to the logs. I could see when I bought it that that rod knuckles were bent because of improper installation and that the RAF updates were not done, as I read through the annual inspection, every where it said replace the inspector had written inspected instead of replaced. At the end was Dofin Fritts name, a little Google search and my conclusion is that if you see his initials or name assume that any repairs or inspections were not actually done.
Sincerely Jason

Jason, the annual or condition inspection is actually just an inspection. In most cases the owners simply allow the inspector (shop) to complete the necessary repairs found during the inspection. However, that is the choice of the owner. Once presented with a list of needed repairs, usually separate from the logbook entry, the owner either completes the repairs himself or hires it done. The owner then returns the aircraft to service. If the IA or A&P does the inspection and completes the work, he signs off the aircraft as airworthy. However, the owner pilot usually makes a maintenance flight and returns the aircraft to service. So, your inspection may have been just that, an inspection. You may not have received the work sheet. If your logbook book has an entry by the inspector stating he has found the aircraft airworthy and the problems were never addressed, that’s another story.

 

[blacktail]

Jason, the annual or condition inspection is actually just an inspection. In most cases the owners simply allow the inspector (shop) to complete the necessary repairs found during the inspection. However, that is the choice of the owner. Once presented with a list of needed repairs, usually separate from the logbook entry, the owner either completes the repairs himself or hires it done. The owner then returns the aircraft to service. If the IA or A&P does the inspection and completes the work, he signs off the aircraft as airworthy. However, the owner pilot usually makes a maintenance flight and returns the aircraft to service. So, your inspection may have been just that, an inspection. You may not have received the work sheet. If your logbook book has an entry by the inspector stating he has found the aircraft airworthy and the problems were never addressed, that’s another story.

Since he took the time to perform a compression test he should have taken the time to write, needs replaced per RAF directives instead of saying inspected and handing the machine off to a new owner, this was well after all off RAF'S required changes. He also wrote still serviceable beside items that RAF said replace. What's the point of inspection if you just put your initials in every slot and say yeah it's inspected, when bolts only reach halfway through nuts, things are in a bind with the machine setting and no updates done would you put your name on the inspection sheet?
My primary point is throughly research, inspect and then observe an A and P when you get a machine so you learn and can feel confident in it.

 

[Mayfield]

he should have taken the time to write, needs replaced per RAF directives instead of saying inspected and handing the machine off to a new owner, this was well after all off RAF'S required changes. He also wrote still serviceable beside items that RAF said replace.

Hi Jason,

RAF, or any other manufacturer of kit aircraft components cannot require replacement of anything. They can use the word "required" but it only means the kit manufacturer wants you to do something. Their "requirement" has no force.

I know you may know this, but RAF, Magni, ELA, AR, TAG, etc. have not manufactured any EAB aircraft. They have manufactured parts that someone can assemble into an aircraft, but they do not control that assembly and are not the manufacturer.

My primary point is throughly research, inspect and then observe an A and P when you get a machine so you learn and can feel confident in it.

Absolutely!

Jim

 

[Vance]

Jason, the annual or condition inspection is actually just an inspection. In most cases the owners simply allow the inspector (shop) to complete the necessary repairs found during the inspection. However, that is the choice of the owner. Once presented with a list of needed repairs, usually separate from the logbook entry, the owner either completes the repairs himself or hires it done. The owner then returns the aircraft to service. If the IA or A&P does the inspection and completes the work, he signs off the aircraft as airworthy. However, the owner pilot usually makes a maintenance flight and returns the aircraft to service. So, your inspection may have been just that, an inspection. You may not have received the work sheet. If your logbook book has an entry by the inspector stating he has found the aircraft airworthy and the problems were never addressed, that’s another story.

I have a divergent view of the annual condition inspection log book entry Bob.

I copied an annual condition inspection log book entry from The Predator and it appears to me to contain language that the aircraft is airworthy on that date.

"1/18/2022 Tach: 2174.8 I certify that I have inspected this airframe I/A/W an OEM 100hr/Annual condition inspection and the scope and detail of FAR part 43 appendix D. No ELT installed. Ads checked to this date. All routine maintenance performed. I have determined this Airframe to be in airworthy condition on this date and tach reading only. James A Foley AP54584969IIA"

My LODA requires 100 hour inspections in addition to the annual condition inspection because I am using The Predator for flight instruction.

 

[wolfy]

Since he took the time to perform a compression test he should have taken the time to write, needs replaced per RAF directives instead of saying inspected and handing the machine off to a new owner, this was well after all off RAF'S required changes. He also wrote still serviceable beside items that RAF said replace. What's the point of inspection if you just put your initials in every slot and say yeah it's inspected, when bolts only reach halfway through nuts, things are in a bind with the machine setting and no updates done would you put your name on the inspection sheet?
My primary point is throughly research, inspect and then observe an A and P when you get a machine so you learn and can feel confident in it.

"Bolts only reach halfway through nuts". Hope you have a real good look at that gyro before it becomes airborne.

 

[Mike Leimetter]

Thread 'Alert on used RAF 2000 for sale — N122LH'

May 14, 2016

Imagine this scenario: you're a gyro newbie, and see a used RAF 2000 for sale. You say to yourself, "Wow, seems like a good deal, but I'm not informed about RAF 2000s. I wish knew somebody experienced in them, as well as acquainted with Seller X of N_____ brokered by Mr. Z. Oh, and I'd like that person's opinion for free!"

May your wish be granted. Consider my posts the "Yelp" for RAF 2000s and N122LH in particular.

I hope that any potential buyer of N122LH does an internet search and reads this. As an RAF 2000 owner, and familiar with not only the broker but also the...

• Kolibri
• Replies: 53
• Forum: RAF - Rotary Air Force

• 

Hope this isn’t the one you purchased. This is a post by Kolibri a while back.

 

[blacktail]

No, but I'm treating it the same as I would that one and going through it top to bottom

 

[Mike Leimetter]

No, but I'm treating it the same as I would that one and going through it top to bottom

Good idea especially since it was the same inspector.

 

[Andino]

blacktail, you're apparently dodging a bullet "fired" years ago by DF. Be thorough, and you'll have a good ship at the end.