I used Bob in my example merely because he was referenced in this thread.
Remarkable, especially given:-
Yet you are doing it, although whilst I might be prepared to accept that your Edwards test pilot might cope with your first one hour trip of this:-
Your average pilot will be swamped. If yours aren't then that in and of itself is a factor worthy of investigation. I find it quite remarkable that during the transit to a practice area any existing pilot in a AutoGyro/Magni product can fly accurately enough to test standard "for heading, altitude and airspeed" then demo some emergency landing scenarios. Then on the way back nail slow flight.
Context. The comment refers to the relationship to an online system that not only will be certainly new to the student but has so many individual actions that a suggestion that all were properly observed and validated in (using your metric) 2 hours of flying would make it meaningless box ticking. If it isn't please educate Phil Harwood who can educate the CAA and a conversation can be had regards the validity of our existing pilots requirement for min 15 hours dual. The delta is so wide that one system must be inefficient / ineffective.
Why do you think?
Not that it is really the main point but student crashes and in the subsequent investigation it is claimed that all of that had been accomplished in a meaningful way with a new pilot in 42 minutes... I think it would be laughed at.
The briefing alone for such a flight for someone with no prior understanding of a gyroplane would be some fete.
Then the final eyebrow raise is that Bloggs does all of this in your Predator and then takes the check ride in a Magni / AutoGyro... ?
So whats the pipeline with this process? Bloggs does his initial training in the Predator, does check ride in an AutoGyro then you continue to do any additional transitional training as required? Which in itself is odd in so far that it is odd to do a check in anything other than the aircraft you've been trained in. Why not just fly the AutoGyro/Magni from hour 1?
If you might agree that part of any learning process includes an instructor demo and student forgetfulness and that part of that is helped by so element of repetition whilst any student inconsistency is highly likely there obviously comes a point where the shear volume of exercise requires a number of hours to make a credible evaluation / validation.
I'd suggest that even 10 hours dual is at the margin and certainly any UK instructors reading this could not fail to agree that even the very best of their existing pilot students do not really find much"idle" time with 15hours of dual instruction.
The point of my post 30 was to answer your question about how long does it take to find out what they can do as it relates to the practical test and to assure you that Bob Snyder was truthful in his estimate of transition time.
It appears to me you have taken my post 30 to mean I claim to transition people to gyroplanes is two hours and you feel I am not truthful. I can’t help you if you won’t make an effort to understand what I have written.
In two hours I can find out what people can and can’t do and create a syllabus to address their challenges. I have not signed off anyone in two hours and as I said at the beginning the average is seven hours of dual instruction for a sign off.
I have found most experienced fixed wing pilots can do the air work in a gyroplane with some homework, a good pre-mission briefing and a little coaching in flight.
If your clients can’t do that the fault is probably in your briefing.
The takeoffs and landings are what usually take the time for an experienced fixed wing pilot to learn to perform well.
The really good pilots can manage takeoffs and landings in a gyroplane with very little coaching. Interestingly they are also the ones who are the most patient with my briefings and do their homework.
I had one client who taught carrier landings that came up with his own syllabus and essentially flew the practical test like an airshow transitioning from one maneuver to the next seamlessly; describing his errors and corrections as he performed each maneuver. He easily flew to half the tolerance of the practical test standards and did it all in just over an hour.
The first day I described with five hours of ground and two hours of dual is typical. I train on the ground and demonstrate in the air. My initial briefing is two and a half to three and a half hours and my first post flight briefing is usually close to and hour.
You ask why do many flight instructors take longer to transition an experienced fixed wing pilot?
To date I have flown with 38 flight instructors. Most only address a task or two on each mission and there is a lot of flight time spent going to and from the practice area. This may be a more thorough way to teach; it certainly takes longer and it is not my way.
Many do not have a lesson plan or have a standard lesson plan for everyone.
The briefing for the lesson is often inadequate and doesn’t give the client an opportunity to ask questions about the specific tasks.
Some are unwilling to listen to or respond to the clients questions.
Some are just more cautious and want more time with the client.
I let the client fly deeper into the mistake than most flight instructors I know and I feel they learn more from their errors that way.
There is never a question about who is flying the aircraft. I found I couldn’t learn anything if someone was “helping” on the controls.
You ask why not start clients in the aircraft they will take the test in.
I train in The Predator because that is the gyroplane I own. She has a wide stance with good suspension front and rear and very little power-pitch-yaw coupling. She has a free castering nose wheel with differential braking for steering. I feel these are all useful for a gyroplane trainer.
The Predator is rugged, benign and capable of taking abuse that a Magni or Autogyro gyroplane may not. I have only aborted two training missions because she had a mechanical issue in almost 2,200 flight hours. She usually manages her 100 hours inspections with only scheduled maintenance.
If the client has a gyroplane available I may train them in that gyroplane.
I recently refused to train a client in The Predator because he had a gyroplane with a spindle head rather than an offset gimbal. I felt the Predator’s heavy control inputs would confuse him flying the Spindle Head so we flew in his gyroplane. I had to learn to fly his gyroplane before I could help him.
As for additional training after they have their certificate; if a Sport Pilot Gyroplane Pilot wants to fly to an airport with an operating control tower they need an endorsement (61.325). This typically takes a half hour of ground and a half hour of dual instruction.
All FAA pilots need a flight review in the preceding 24 calendar months to be legal to fly so I will typically see them in two years (61.56).
A few clients ask for training in advanced maneuvers outside the practical test standards.
