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  • #16
    Yes I did get insurance

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    • #17

      After spending about 4 hours in a friends 2 place gyro, I'm hooked!, I am currently a CFI for both Fixed-wing and Weight-shift and have been considering purchasing a new gyro to eventually offer instruction in, after many hrs of experience of course. The price tag on the 914 machines may be a bit over my budget and I am told that the 912 may not be adequate for all training situations.

      I have a friend with a Yamaha powered trike, he has used both the carb & FI versions. The engines have performed very well, but he has had some issues with the redrives, both belt and gear. He says,"The engine is great, it's all about the gearbox", he does not think anyone has enough time on them to predict their reliability. I would like to know more regarding the reliability of the Yamaha in the Tango and would like to know how the performance compares to the 912/914 powered machines.

      Thank you,
      Dutch

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Dutch View Post
        After spending about 4 hours in a friends 2 place gyro, I'm hooked!, I am currently a CFI for both Fixed-wing and Weight-shift and have been considering purchasing a new gyro to eventually offer instruction in, after many hrs of experience of course. The price tag on the 914 machines may be a bit over my budget and I am told that the 912 may not be adequate for all training situations.

        I have a friend with a Yamaha powered trike, he has used both the carb & FI versions. The engines have performed very well, but he has had some issues with the redrives, both belt and gear. He says,"The engine is great, it's all about the gearbox", he does not think anyone has enough time on them to predict their reliability. I would like to know more regarding the reliability of the Yamaha in the Tango and would like to know how the performance compares to the 912/914 powered machines.

        Thank you,
        Dutch
        I see the Tangos fly every weekend along with hangar mate Kurt Carlsen in his single place Air Command with the YG4 carb version. Kurt is getting over 651 lbs of thrust and 150 HP and he climbs at well over 1200 fpm with 28' blades using a Tango gear box and donut. The YG3 has more torque, but, less HP and it requires a clutch. I am buying a Tango 2 next year and have not decided on which engine, but, they definitely out perform Rotax and are now getting to be as reliable after more than a year of R & D in our club here in Georgia.
        Last edited by shootthrees; 10-02-2017, 12:43 PM.
        Kind Regards,

        Tom Duncan

        Blog: http://texassportpilot.blogspot.com/

        PRA #42071
        EAA #738671
        AOPA #05028938

        Member: Peach State Rotorcraft Club http://peachstaterotorcraft.org

        “Success is peace of mind which is a direct result of self-satisfaction in knowing you made the effort to become the best of which you are capable.” - John Wooden

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        • #19
          Since this video was shot, Kurt started using the Tangogyro 4 Blade prop for over 650 lbs of thrust.
           
          Last edited by shootthrees; 10-04-2017, 11:42 AM. Reason: used the wrong term
          Kind Regards,

          Tom Duncan

          Blog: http://texassportpilot.blogspot.com/

          PRA #42071
          EAA #738671
          AOPA #05028938

          Member: Peach State Rotorcraft Club http://peachstaterotorcraft.org

          “Success is peace of mind which is a direct result of self-satisfaction in knowing you made the effort to become the best of which you are capable.” - John Wooden

          Comment


          • #20
            Thank you Tom, I really appreciate you feedback. It sounds like the Tango gyro is well made, I just hope the powerplant holds up in the long run. Getting Rotax 914 performance for a lot less is very appealing to me.
            Does anyone know how much time has been put on the current Yamaha/ gear drive combo?

            Thanks,
            Dutch

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            • #21
              Originally posted by gyrojake View Post

              Very true Steve, but that does not mean an engine not designed for aviation is not a good choice.
              Many automobile and recreational engines have been converted for aviation with great success .
              There is no good argument in EXPERIMENTAL engines with a good reputation to be degraded by people with no real life experience.
              I personally don't care about the rules in other countries, since we are talking about an American based project.
              I think it is awesome that well minded people are finding alternative power plants for flying machines that match and even out perform aviation engines.
              In my opinion the 912 and 914 are over rated V.W. engines nothing more and nothing less.
              Some of the first experimental aircraft used motorcycle engines, the R/V used a Subaru car engine the original Bensen used an aircraft engine that was designed to run for 30 minutes, but they all turned out to be very successful engines in the right hands with the right modifications.
              You seem to downplay anything that has not been approved by the European government, indoctrination leads to stagnation.
              Well said Jake!!!!
              Kind Regards,

              Tom Duncan

              Blog: http://texassportpilot.blogspot.com/

              PRA #42071
              EAA #738671
              AOPA #05028938

              Member: Peach State Rotorcraft Club http://peachstaterotorcraft.org

              “Success is peace of mind which is a direct result of self-satisfaction in knowing you made the effort to become the best of which you are capable.” - John Wooden

              Comment


              • #22
                The only pitfall I seen in engine conversions is snake oil sales men. Any time you are flying a converted engine you are probably the only person flying that exact configuration of engine, prop, gearbox and you are a test pilot. You do not know if the combination is going to fly 10 hours or 1000 before failure. Not only do you need to fly like your engine might quit but you have no reason to assume that it might continue to run for the next 10 minuets. With the expensive engines you have reasonable proof (by the 10's of thousands of hours on the fleet in the exact same configuration) that it will continue to run. My soap box is people who sell conversion kits that claim reliability of parts. There was someone here selling "lifetime guarantee" Sprague clutches that had very few hours of testing on them. He was putting these clutches on "the most reliable engines" with various combinations of gear boxes and touting the package as bullet proof.

                The only truly valid test of a systems reliability is hours of operation. Always ask how many hours does this configuration (engine, dampner/clutch, gearbox, propeller) have in the field. The answer to that question will let you know how far on the bleeding edge you are when you move forward.

                This is not directed Tango Gyro in any way, I have had no interactions with them and have not seen them making wild claims about reliability.

                I have converted a couple engines and would do it again. I just really want people to know what they are getting in to and to always ask about hours of operation (in aircraft configuration) when faced with claims of reliability and adjust their expectations accordingly.

                FWIW
                Jason

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                • #23
                  As far as the yamaha's go...the 3 cyl. and 4 cyl. engines. The numbers and stats are being collected and collated and at the end of this yr. 2017 I will put together the results.
                  I have a 4 cyl. and so far nothing but joy! As an observation they both have been in service now for some @ going on 5 yrs. with great results.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by JasonS View Post
                    As far as the yamaha's go...the 3 cyl. and 4 cyl. engines. The numbers and stats are being collected and collated and at the end of this yr. 2017 I will put together the results.
                    I have a 4 cyl. and so far nothing but joy! As an observation they both have been in service now for some @ going on 5 yrs. with great results.
                    Hello Jason,
                    As you do this you should also include what gearbox, dampner and propeller are on the installations. If anything in the power train fails, its a forced landing even if the engine is still running. I will eagerly await your results and thanks for taking the time to collect the information.

                    Best
                    Jason O

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by JasonS View Post
                      As far as the yamaha's go...the 3 cyl. and 4 cyl. engines. The numbers and stats are being collected and collated and at the end of this yr. 2017 I will put together the results.
                      I have a 4 cyl. and so far nothing but joy! As an observation they both have been in service now for some @ going on 5 yrs. with great results.
                      Hello JasonS

                      It would also be worth noting in the stats you are collecting what RPM the engines are being operated at. I know the 4cyl engines are often operated in the 8,000 RPM to 9,000 RPM range for max take off because their application does not require the full 140hp available. I can imagine that an engine being operated at 8,000RPM on take off and 7,000RPM at cruise would be much less likely to fail than an engine operating at 10,500RPM for take off and 8,500RPM for cruise. The 4 cyl engine is capable of being either of these engines but I would bet engine and component wear is different.

                      FWIW
                      Jason O

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