First Sub-Freezing Gyro Flight

PW_Plack

Active Member
Joined
Oct 30, 2003
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8,573
Location
West Valley City, Utah, USA
I've been enjoying the Sport Copter Vortex 582 for the last few months, but this weekend was the first time I've flown it - or any gyro - at temps below freezing. The occasion was an organizational meeting for a new EAA chapter based at Woodhouse Field at Spanish Fork, about 26 nm from where I hangar at Nephi, UT.

The temp was 17º F (-8º C) when I got to the airport at 7:20am, with hopes for wheels-up by 8am, but I had to return to the hangar and partially block the radiator to get water temp to budge off the bottom of the gauge on the 582. (Elevation 5020' MSL.) After that all worked well, water temp 140-150º F, EGTs 1080/1120º at cruise, and she burned 8 gallons in 1.8 hours round-trip, including ground ops at both ends.

PRA Chapter 2 President Doug Barker was at the meeting and took this photo as I was preparing to depart Spanish Fork for the return trip. I hope to get a GoPro going soon so I can capture the stunning visuals from winter flights in this area. The beauty of the scenery made it all worth donning two sets of long johns, sweatshirt and insulated ski pants, and heavy coat.

By the way, congrats to CFI Mike Burton on his election as president of the new EAA chapter, number to be determined!
 

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You’re tougher than I am Paul. I draw the line at thirty two degrees f.
 
Vance, it really wasn't bad. I had on enough layers to stay warm behind the partial pod, even my knees and the edges of my shoulders which got cold on some earlier flights. The only two issues were keeping my glasses from fogging inside the helmet, and stretching to reach the ends of the shoulder belts and the key for the starter when the clothing plumped me out like the Michelin Man.

Besides, you're clearly tougher. I draw the line at 200 MPH in ground vehicles!
 
Paul. I'll second Vance. When my OAT gets much below 40°F, My compass will only read South. I did once fly the Safari up in Canada with below freezing temps and the only in flight planning that was done was get this thing on the ground and me close to a warm stove. That kind of OAT is the perfect temperature for Hangar Flying. (if you have heat). I was once in a machine on the ground at about 200mph, but the guy in the front seat pulled back on the stick and we shot straight up to 30,000 msl. while I was trying to get my mind caught up. Thats when the telephone poles look like a picket fence.
 
Wow, that is some picture! Paul, for your altitude, have you gone to a bigger rotor? Also, if you use a radio at your airport, what configuration do you have for headphones and communication?
Did you notice a noticeable performance gain at that temperature? Sorry for the million questions!
Steven
 
Paul, I must have missed something ! Congrats ! You got a gyro & flying in sub temps.....wow !

Is this your first gyro ? How's the radio working ? LOL

I thought about getting a real good snow suit for cold temps but my eyes tear like crazy......what's on your eyes ?

Way to go bud ! I am gonna have to check out all of your posts.....I missed the big news ! Did you get a great deal or what ?
 
Went back 7 pages of your posts....to 2016......not one mention of you getting a gyro ! Sneaky & secret.....I wondered why I didn't see anything ?

GOOD FOR YOU, PAUL !
 
Went back & clicked on your pic ! Primo single place , man ! How well does the cycle helmet block engine noise ?

I used to wear a Simpson Bandit but it did not quiet things down.....when I got my Comtronics Heli-pro I realized what I had been missing.

Does the shield block the wind well ? Oh you have 2 shields !!

Those extended range tanks look just like mine from Air Command.......How are they piped in ?

What is your total fuel capacity ?

How fast does she go ? Keep warm & fly safe ! I am very excited for you ! Way to go ! Details.....more details !

What radio ?

Non ethanol ? Oil ?
 
Conjrats Paul, it would have been very hard for me to wait until all the paperwork was done before flying but you did it the right way.

Almost 2 hours in sub freezing, you must have wanted it very bad, way to go
 
Wow, lotsa questions!

Steven;n1127099 said:
Paul, for your altitude, have you gone to a bigger rotor? Also, if you use a radio at your airport, what configuration do you have for headphones and communication? Did you notice a noticeable performance gain at that temperature?

Steven, the rotors are still 25', but they're the 8" chord upgrade. Heavy, but they fly well and land sweet! They were turning about 340 in straight-&-level cruise Saturday, 350 in the summer. In my experience that's a little higher than I'd expect for Sport Rotors, but I was getting 60 MPH at 5950 RPM in cruise, so they're performing well.

The machine was making 500-600 feet-per-minute in climb Saturday. The prop may have a little too much pitch, as wide open straight-&-level is only getting about 6300 RPM, slightly less in warm weather. Nephi's elevation is 5,020 MSL, so up here a 582 is a 50-55 HP engine. I burned just over 4 GPH on this trip, including ground ops.

The panel has a MicroAir radio, but I'm researching a new setup for a magazine article I'm writing. It's Icom's new IC25N handheld, which has a built-in bluetooth interface, and pairs to an integrated headset in the helmet. Push-to-talk is still via a coiled, plug-in cable and a button velcro'd to the side of the cyclic, but I hope to refine it further. The handheld with the rubber duck antenna was almost useless, but I made a copper-tape dipole along the right side door opening, and it's much better.

CLS447;n1127100 said:
Wow ! Is this your first gyro ? How's the radio working ? LOL I thought about getting a real good snow suit for cold temps but my eyes tear like crazy......what's on your eyes ? Did you get a great deal or what ?

Chris, this gyro was donated to URA in non-airworthy condition, and we hoped to make it available in a group ownership plan for students needing a machine in which to do their solo requirements for training. That program stalled for a couple years, so finally Charlie Wakamatsu and I went in as partners, got it airworthy at our own personal expense, and will fly it for a bit. It will be sold in the spring with all sale proceeds going to URA to fund educational programs.

It's not the first Sport Copter I've flown, and I once owned a Sport Copter kit I sold unfinished. So, this is the first gyro I've both owned and flown!

CLS447;n1127102 said:
How well does the cycle helmet block engine noise ? Does the shield block the wind well ? What is your total fuel capacity ? How fast does she go ? What radio ? Non ethanol ? Oil ?

I tried a bunch of helmets, and went with a Shoei GT Air, mostly because it fit me the best, and reviews from bikers said it's aerodynamics do a great job at keeping wind noise to a minimum. (Won't be an issue with a pod.) I don't like helmets with protrusions on the sides for headsets, because I feel they compromise protection by creating a possible focal point for the impact. The Shoei doesn't block much engine noise, so I use earplugs underneath and make the radio louder, which has worked pretty well. I've flown with the helmet with temps in the 90's and in the teens, and magically, it was comfortable in both cases.

I'd like to go with active noise reduction headphones, but I really like the bluetooth system, and don't know how ANR could be adapted to this system. Ironically, the vents work really well, but the pod keeps the wind from reaching the vents, so I keep the face shield open to the first notch to keep my glasses from fogging up. I haven't had the tear issue yet.

On Saturday I was wearing a set of non-polarized amber sunglasses that fit over my regular glasses. They're not clip-ons, but a full pair of sunglasses, including bows, designed with enough clearance to go on over regular glasses. The face shield actually clears them, and has its own green sunshade which can be deployed behind the clear shield by sliding an actuator on the side of the helmet. (But I prefer amber.)

The Sport Copter pod does a nice job of keeping the wind off you from head to toe. There's just enough breeze on each shoulder to tell me when I'm slipping or skidding without a yaw string. The sides of my knees got cold during a flight a week earlier, so I came prepared with insulated ski pants over my jeans, and I was comfortable. The machine could use a little more tail with the pod mounted, and the newer M912 addressed this with a larger tail on a longer arm. I need to replace the fuel lines on the aux tanks, so I haven't been using them, but total with the aux is about 13.7 gallons. She's heavy for a single-place, and the 582's 14 years old without a rebuild, but she'll do about 70. It's more comfortable at 60.

There's a fuel distributor here in the Salt Lake Valley that sells 91-octane, ethanol-free unleaded for $3.16/gallon, and I fill my cans before I go to the airport. Charlie was getting ethanol-free 88 unleaded and mixing it with lead-free 100-octane racing fuel to make 91 UL E0, but that was a little costlier. We've felt strongly about staying as close as possible to Rotax's recommendations for the 582. The machine has not had lead or ethanol in the tank since we got it. Oil is the Pennzoil air-cooled two-stroke formula in the little green bottles.

dabkb2;n1127125 said:
Congrats Paul, it would have been very hard for me to wait until all the paperwork was done before flying but you did it the right way. Almost 2 hours in sub freezing, you must have wanted it very bad, way to go

Dave, thanks! What I wanted most Saturday was to be the only person to fly in to the EAA chapter organization meeting, and to have done it in a gyro. That made the cold worth it. But you know, flying on a clear winter morning when you have the airport to yourself is peaceful and spectacularly beautiful. I hope to fly all winter.

Documenting the ownership trail was difficult for this machine. It changed hands once without being registered, was owned at one point by an LLC which since went defunct, and was co-owned for a while by in-laws who are now estranged and living on opposite coasts. We started the process in the spring, and finally satisfied the FAA's last documentation needs in October. All that's behind us now, and Charlie and I have clear title. When it's sold next year, everything should be routine for the new owner.

And I have a four-day weekend coming up with sunshine in the forecast. Woo-hoo!
 
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Thanks Paul & great work ! Thanks for the answers & I will think of more to ask.......I have the day off....I am going to run conduit to my gyro garage & finally get some permanent power in there ! Pics to follow. Have a great day !
 
Vance;n1127090 said:
You’re tougher than I am Paul. I draw the line at thirty two degrees f.

You both much tougher than me, I draw the line at 32 degrees C
 
I am seriously impressed. At 4C and a sunny morning I could not resist the desire to fly. It was thermals, US type Under Armour top and bottom, jeans, thick woollen shirt jersey, fleece, flight suit, silk gloves Cape leather RAF gloves then Motor Cycle gloves.

The Besen performed like never before. My face froze first but then despite the three layer of gloves my hands were the ones that concerned me by growing numb. I started to lose sensation. I only lasted around 40 mins before I came back in because I could not feel the stick.

But then being African born I do not function well below 20C. It was a flight I won’t forget... but won’t repeat.
 
Resasi;n1127289 said:
The Besen performed like never before. My face froze first but then despite the three layer of gloves my hands were the ones that concerned me by growing numb...

Leigh, I was much better protected from the wind than you were. Between the Vortex pod and the motorcycle helmet, there wasn't much comparison to an open Bensen and an older style helmet. And yes - before I got my insulated gloves, my hands would get cold, even behind the pod.

I took advantage of the four-day Thanksgiving holiday weekend to get in three more hours Friday, and three more Saturday, at temps ranging from about 5ºC to 20ºC. (Yes - This is near-record warmth for this area at this time of year.) I'm learning which combinations of layers work at various temps. I really think I'll be able to continue flying throughout the winter. The 582 sure loves the cold, but then I guess that's based on genes handed down from its ancestors!
 
The last time I flew near freezing was interesting. The extra bulk add a bit of pilot workload, gloves make it hard to press buttons and a bit more time to prep for the flight. Since then, mid 40s is about the lowest enjoyable limit and that is not hard to avoid around here.

Paul, on the 582, water temp minimum is 150, running below that is not recommended due to possible engine seizure. I keep the temps between 150 and 180. Lots of playing around with cardboard for the right length to cover the radiator.
 
All of the above is the reason that enclosed heated cabins were invented,I have enough time in open cockpit planes to appreciate them.
 
I'd rather push my Harley than drive a cage ! LOL ! Cabins make me dizzy !
 
I'm preparing for a 10-mile cross-country on Thursday, so I wanted to inspect and test the aux fuel tanks system on the gyro, especially since the transfer pump hadn't been run in five years or more. All worked fine, although transfer time is longer than anticipated, about 16 minutes for five gallons. I don't plan to use the pump in the air, but will transfer fuel at one of the stops.

I made one brief flight with all the tanks full just to make sure the 582 would successfully lift the gyro, 190 pounds of me, and 81 pounds of fuel (about 725 pounds total). It does, and the thing actually takes off and lands nicely at full load, although the climb rate is only about 250 feet per minute at 5,500' MSL at 50ºF (10ºC). Rotor RPM was up to 360. Expected temp at takeoff Thursday is about 15ºF (-9ºC), and if I get 400 FPM at that temp, I should have the margins I need for the terrain.

The route (below) is Nephi to Delta, 36.1 nm, then to Manti-Ephraim, 41.4 nm, then back to Nephi, 27.1 nm. The total is 104.6 nautical miles, but that's based on straight-line distance, which isn't practical for this machine given the terrain. I figure I'll be able to cut corners slightly from the worst-case flight path on the chart below if I can climb well, but that worst case might be 125 nm. I plan to take on a couple gallons of avgas at Delta before starting the second leg.

After the maintenance Saturday I did a brief test flight to check performance. By the time I landed, we were into civil twilight and the airport lights had come on, making for a spectacular sight. I ran in the hangar and grabbed my phone to get a photo, below. I love flying at this airport, especially around dawn and dusk.

On to Thursday!
 

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perbgyro;n1127537 said:
The last time I flew near freezing was interesting. The extra bulk add a bit of pilot workload, gloves make it hard to press buttons and a bit more time to prep for the flight...

...on the 582, water temp minimum is 150, running below that is not recommended due to possible engine seizure. I keep the temps between 150 and 180. Lots of playing around with cardboard for the right length to cover the radiator.

Understood. I was looking for 140º before starting the takeoff roll. The small radiator the builder of this machine chose is close to the perfect size for this engine, gains a few degrees under full power, but has never topped 180ºF in the summer. It does run a little cold in this weather, and has no thermostat. I may need a larger piece of cardboard Thursday, with a way to remove some when the temp gets up into the 30's, expected by the end of the flight.

And you're right about "Michelin Man Effect." With all the layers and the insulated gloves, it's a little hard to lift my leg over the seat getting in, or get the belts fastened, let alone turn my torso to look back or straight down. I was thinking today about where I might put a little mirror so I can see the sight tube in flight. It would have to be on my right knee, I think!

The first time I flew with the Icom A25 radio, I hadn't set up any memories yet. I figured out quickly that manually tuning the VFO in flight was not a glove-friendly way to operate. Now, I have memories set for all the AWOS/ASOS, CTAF and tower frequencies in the area. Still not as good as an up/down function wired to a hat switch on the stick, but much better. I'm still hoping to get a dongle figured out that will allow using my bluetooth helmet setup with the MicroAir panel radio.
 
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I'm sorry to report my cross-country flight ended in an off-airport landing. There were no injuries to me or anyone else, the machine stayed right-side up, and the only damage to the machine in the landing was the nosewheel tire and strut. The machine is back in the hangar.

This incident will make for a rich conversation about accident chains. I'll get into it in more detail in another thread when I calm down, process all this, and finish with all the phone calls.
 
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