Rotary Wing Forum  

Go Back   Rotary Wing Forum > Kit Makers & Manufacturers > Helicycle

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 4 votes, 5.00 average. Display Modes
  #16  
Old 10-27-2013, 04:32 AM
StanFoster's Avatar
StanFoster StanFoster is offline
Gold Supporter
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Paxton, Il
Posts: 16,472
Default

Ron- You make valid points, all of which I have agreed with.

If your flying only needs to start and end at an airport, a gyro does this safer, cheaper, and with less machinery to inspect, and in most cases spend more time maintaining.

Your statement that a gyro does 95% of what a
helicopter can do is right on, and I have said that many times.

What you don't get is that some of us that have experienced the 5% area that only a helicopter can provide .....feel it is a whole different experience being able to hover and have the capability to land and takeoff most anywhere. The freedom I have felt experiencing this has totally spoiled me.

However, if operating in this 5% area doesn't thrill you enough....and some could care less!.....then it's stupid having a helicopter if all you want to do is fly from runway to runway.

But just for myself speaking, after 800 hours of flying gyros, it is a whole new world for me to be flying along and pull my speed back to 0 mph, stop that world from moving underneath me and just park it a couple of feet high and just look around and even set her down on it........instead of having to maintain flight airspeed in my gyro and fly on by.

The last paragraph either makes it worth to have a helicopter or makes it worth it to fly a gyro. What excites some of us doesn't others.

I still totally agree with you that gyros can do 95% of what a helicopter can far cheaper, safer, and in "most" cases, with less maintenance.

So, go fly what fits your needs/ budget the best! Its all a great experience!

Stan
__________________
PPSEL airplane/helicopter

Helicopters turn air into their runway.

Got kerosene?

www.stansstairways.com
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 10-27-2013, 06:09 AM
turbo's Avatar
turbo turbo is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: stuart fl/ s windsor ct/ virgin gorda bvi
Posts: 551
Send a message via Skype™ to turbo
Default

Another way to look at this is to determine your needs and budget.

By the way, where is here in your profile?

Good luck in your quest.
__________________
Ed DArcy 'Turbo'
R-44 1,200 hrs / RV-6 4,500 hrs / gyro SOLD, Helicycle 50 hrs, 39,000 miles flow in 2013.
Stuart FL / S Windsor Ct / Virgin Gorda BVI
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 10-27-2013, 11:14 AM
Junglejett Junglejett is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Here
Posts: 25
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GyroRon View Post

A gyro can do 95 percent of what you would do with one for a fraction of the price
Hell, a jet can do 90% of what a helicopter can do...and a whole lot more.

However, it cannot hover and land on a small spot, pinnacle, confined area. ect. I want to do those things so a gyro is 100% out of the question.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 10-27-2013, 01:02 PM
StanFoster's Avatar
StanFoster StanFoster is offline
Gold Supporter
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Paxton, Il
Posts: 16,472
Default

Junglejet- Then you are in the same camp I am that want to hover and take off from most anywhere. I was just out flying today and a friend waved me in to his place. After a hi and lo recon....I landed and that's what I am talking about!

Another part of the 5% that a helicopter has is nor having that 500 foot rule
I have some videos today that I took that would have been illegal in a gyro.

Stan
__________________
PPSEL airplane/helicopter

Helicopters turn air into their runway.

Got kerosene?

www.stansstairways.com
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 10-27-2013, 01:34 PM
WaspAir's Avatar
WaspAir WaspAir is offline
heli/gyro cfi
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 3,084
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Junglejett View Post
Hell, a jet can do 90% of what a helicopter can do...and a whole lot more.

However, it cannot hover and land on a small spot, pinnacle, confined area. ect. I want to do those things so a gyro is 100% out of the question.
You're stretching a bit on the jet comparison -- most jets will do almost none of what a helicopter can do, such as:
fly under 80 knots without stalling,
fly with no spin risk,
fly backwards or sideways,
carry an external load,
land on floats,
land in snow,
winch up passengers,
operate without an airport,
etc.

There are two questions being kicked around here:
1) why a helicopter?
2) if a helicopter, why a Helicycle?

I've already got one foot in the helicopter camp, so I answered (1) long ago. As to (2), I fly a Bell 47G3B1 instead of a Helicycle because I can seat three, carry lots of weight, go much farther, go much higher, like having doors and a heater, insure it easily, didn't have to build it myself, can get parts and service everywhere, and like the confidence inspired by a fully certified design. Those factors were important enough to me to spend more bucks to get what I prefer.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 10-27-2013, 03:07 PM
heli49north heli49north is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Oliver
Posts: 11
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaspAir View Post
You're stretching a bit on the jet comparison -- most jets will do almost none of what a helicopter can do, such as:
fly under 80 knots without stalling,
fly with no spin risk,
fly backwards or sideways,
carry an external load,
land on floats,
land in snow,
winch up passengers,
operate without an airport,
etc.

There are two questions being kicked around here:
1) why a helicopter?
2) if a helicopter, why a Helicycle?

I've already got one foot in the helicopter camp, so I answered (1) long ago. As to (2), I fly a Bell 47G3B1 instead of a Helicycle because I can seat three, carry lots of weight, go much farther, go much higher, like having doors and a heater, insure it easily, didn't have to build it myself, can get parts and service everywhere, and like the confidence inspired by a fully certified design. Those factors were important enough to me to spend more bucks to get what I prefer.
Wasp air, You have the advantage of being to be able to take passengers, possibly more range, certified of course but... I have full doors on my helicycle, AND a HEATER! Parts are not hard to get from Eagle, for the couple of times that I have needed them. Insurance is not a problem. Building it was a fun and fulfilling experience. What is your cruise speed? And as far as elevation goes.... I`m going to call you on that one. As far as needing service everywhere so far it has proven to be quite reliable and doesn`t need to be serviced everywhere.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 10-27-2013, 03:32 PM
brett s's Avatar
brett s brett s is offline
Gold Supporter
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Ball Ground, GA
Posts: 2,383
Default

That 47G3B1 is turbocharged, so yeah, it'll do better than most at altitude.
__________________
Brett Sumpter
Roswell, GA
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 10-27-2013, 04:09 PM
bryancobb's Avatar
bryancobb bryancobb is offline
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Cartersville, GA
Posts: 3,866
Default

My mini is a $10,000 machine and costs $20/hr to fly. That's all I can afford. My Brantly used to cost $70/hr in fuel & oil. My $400-$700 per month fuel bill was sinking me, so I sold it.

I never could afford insurance on any aircraft I had.

For all you rich fellas that have no limit on what you can spend on your "toy," go for it. If I could afford a $50k Helicycle, I'd have a high time R-22 that I could share the experience in, but that's even out for me.

Even on this Mini, I'm going to have to limit myself to 10 hours per month or I won't be able to pay my bills. I have no car payments, no credit cards, and the only outstanding debt I have is my remaining balance on my home.

Where the hell do you guys work?
__________________
Bryan Cobb, Boiler/Presure Vessel Designer, AutoCAD Draftsman
Commercial Pilot, Rotorcraft/Helicopter, US Army Trained, Royal Blue Flight, Class 87-17, TH-55, UH-1H, CH-47C
US Air Force Munitions Maintenance 46170 1979-1986
Commercial Instrument Pilot, Fixed Wing/SEL
CFI, Sport, Fixed Wing, Tailwheel
1200 Helicopter PIC, 100 Mini-500, 320 Brantly B-2b
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 10-27-2013, 04:30 PM
Blue Chips Blue Chips is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Ohio
Posts: 555
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bryancobb View Post
Where the hell do you guys work?
I can tell you where they don't work, On Target Sports
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 10-27-2013, 05:30 PM
Junglejett Junglejett is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Here
Posts: 25
Default

..notes in bold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaspAir View Post
You're stretching a bit on the jet comparison -- most jets will do almost none of what a helicopter can do, such as:
fly under 80 knots without stalling: Depends on the jet.
fly with no spin risk, Stay away from a stall, and you will not spin.
fly backwards or sideways; The AV8B...will do that.
carry an external load: Sling load? You are right. Tons of other external loads.
land on floats: They have done that as well...google Russian sea plane.
land in snow: That too.
winch up passengers: True.
operate without an airport: sure they do. The Brits trained to operate off of highways. The Russians can and have landed the Mig-29 on grass. Then there is the carrier.
etc.



They are also crazy expensive to operate!!

There are two questions being kicked around here:
1) why a helicopter?
2) if a helicopter, why a Helicycle?

I've already got one foot in the helicopter camp, so I answered (1) long ago. As to (2), I fly a Bell 47G3B1 instead of a Helicycle because I can seat three, carry lots of weight, go much farther, go much higher, like having doors and a heater, insure it easily, didn't have to build it myself, can get parts and service everywhere, and like the confidence inspired by a fully certified design. Those factors were important enough to me to spend more bucks to get what I prefer.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 10-27-2013, 05:31 PM
Junglejett Junglejett is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Here
Posts: 25
Default

You can also stall a helo.....blade stall. And it wont spint, just come straight down..with no chance of recovery.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 10-27-2013, 08:38 PM
WaspAir's Avatar
WaspAir WaspAir is offline
heli/gyro cfi
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 3,084
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by heli49north View Post
Wasp air, You have the advantage of being to be able to take passengers, possibly more range, certified of course but... I have full doors on my helicycle, AND a HEATER! Parts are not hard to get from Eagle, for the couple of times that I have needed them. Insurance is not a problem. Building it was a fun and fulfilling experience. What is your cruise speed? And as far as elevation goes.... I`m going to call you on that one. As far as needing service everywhere so far it has proven to be quite reliable and doesn`t need to be serviced everywhere.
My service ceiling per the flight manual is 20,000 feet. Not gonna see many Helicycles up there, I'll bet.

I carry 57 gallons, so the range is probably not a contest.

My Bell has about 5000 hours on it. You're not going to get that far in anything, reliable or not, without needing plenty of parts and lots of service, and if you go places on jobs like Bells do, you'll never know where in the world you might be when the need arises.

Glad you're enjoying your bird. Fly safe.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 10-27-2013, 09:07 PM
WaspAir's Avatar
WaspAir WaspAir is offline
heli/gyro cfi
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 3,084
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Junglejett View Post
..notes in bold.
Name me ONE jet (a single type, not a bunch of very different ones) that will do all of that, and I'll concede. When you see a Harrier pick up and carry a jeep, hover over water and winch up a swimmer, dip a bambi bucket and dowse a fire, pick up passengers from a rooftop heliport, or hover for an hour taking news video, let me know. Plenty of helicopters can do it all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Junglejett View Post
You can also stall a helo.....blade stall. And it wont spint, just come straight down..with no chance of recovery.
If you're talking about unrecoverable low rotor rpm (which I assume because retreating blade stall is fully recoverable), that's not the same animal by any stretch of the imagination; next we'll be talking about "compressor stalls" in jets just because they use the same word as part of the term. Slow down an airplane, and it falls out of the sky. Slow down a helicopter, and it flies slowly. Stall-spin accidents in airplanes are as common as cliches, and helicopters are immune to that particular illness.

I think we're a bit off the topic here, so I'm going to bow out and let people get back to talking about the Helicycle pros and cons. I don't want one because it doesn't fit my mission requirements. I can certainly see how others might find it fun.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 10-27-2013, 09:35 PM
Junglejett Junglejett is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Here
Posts: 25
Default

Wasp..I am on board with you. I was just pointing out that there are airplanes that are capable of what you said. We could start a discussion about tilt rotors...half airplane/half helo.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 10-28-2013, 05:09 AM
GyroRon's Avatar
GyroRon GyroRon is offline
Former Gyro know it all
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Fort Mill South Carolina
Posts: 16,108
Default

Stan, I would enjoy a helicopter more than a gyro for the reasons you listed. No doubt about it. But I guess it does come down to budget, it would be so much more expensive to own and operate a helicopter than a gyro, I would just pick the gyro.

The guy who posted this thread asked why would you NOT buy a helicycle and the reasons given where why I wouldn't buy one. Not that I wouldn't totally enjoy owning and flying one.

Id also love to have a jacked up 4x4 diesel 3/4 ton truck, and a fully modified jeep wrangler, some kind of old classic 40's or 50's car, a muscle car, and a badass sportscar of some sort. Id also like to have a Piper cub, and a Vans RV-8. I would like a 4000 square foot house in a fancy neighborhood, with the finest furniture and decor..... Maybe also a 30 foot triple tube Pontoon boat, with a 250 hp yamaha outboard. Wish my GF had bigger boobs, and or that I could have multiple GF's..... And wish I weighted about 25 pounds less and had more hair on my head and less on my back and shoulders.
__________________
Thats what she said.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:51 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Ad Management plugin by RedTyger
You Rated this Thread: