Line up and wait.

choppergabor

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FAA Safety Team | Safer Skies Through Education Line Up and Wait
Notice Number: NOTC2554

Line Up and Wait Phraseology Change


· Beginning September 30, 2010 , the words Line Up and Wait will replace the words “Position and Hold” to instruct a pilot to enter the runway to await take-off clearance. Under the new “Line Up and Wait phraseology, the controller will:

- State your call-sign;
- State the departure runway;
- State “Line Up and Wait”.

· Exercise Caution. Be aware the phrase “Traffic Holding in Position” will continue to be used to advise other aircraft that traffic has been authorized to “Line Up and Wait” on an active runway.

· REMEMBER: Never cross a hold line without explicit ATC instructions. You may not enter a runway unless you have been:

- Instructed to cross or taxi onto that specific runway
- Cleared to take off from that runway, or
- Instructed to “Line Up and Wait” on that specific runway.

Please visit: [url]www.faa.gov/go/runwaysafety/[/URL] for more details on the change as well as to view an instructional animation explaining the new phraseology.

If in doubt ASK!

For additional information, go to [url]http://www.faa.gov/go/runwaysafety[/URL]
Federal Aviation Administration
Office of Runway Safety
490 L'Enfant Plaza, SW, Suite 7225
Washington, DC 20024
 
Gabor...

Gabor...

It seems like they are "Dumbing Down" the lingo to make sure the instructions are clearly understood by people who don't speak english as a primary language. This is not only safer and smarter, but will probably be easier to teach new students. Although if anyone could be a pilot they wouldn't get paid as much.
Ben S
 
It seems like they are "Dumbing Down" the lingo to make sure the instructions are clearly understood by people who don't speak english as a primary language. This is not only safer and smarter, but will probably be easier to teach new students. Although if anyone could be a pilot they wouldn't get paid as much.
Ben S

I've heard that explanation, but I don't understand how "wait" is any shorter or easier to process than "hold". They'll still be saying "hold short". Should we expect that to become "wait and don't cross"?

If they really enforced the "English proficient" rules we wouldn't need this.

There's a great deal of ab initio training in my area for ANA, JAL, etc., and it's bloody scary to be in the air around them. Their radio calls are absolutely incomprehensible, so you never know what they're going to do.
 
"Line up and wait" is the terminology used in England, the origional English speakers. :lol:

Nice to know you guys are finally catching up. :lol:
 
"Position and hold" sounds too much like "Hold Position". If at a busy airport a pilot is told to "hold position", misunderstands, and instead taxis into "position and holds" while a 747 lands on top of him, that could be a problem. Hence, the change in terminology.
 
"Be able to read, speak, write, and understand the English language" Perhaps they need to add "use"??

I could be wrong however.......... I'm just sayin'
 
Well with my thick accent I can completely understand the effort to make things easy to understand. For a foreign tongue pilot anything that makes communication easy and understandable and unmistakable will make the possibility of runway incursion less and I can only applaud the effort. Lot's of guys from India with horrible accents are into aviation. I add the low quality radio sound to the equation and there is a disaster waiting to happen. In my opinion the radio technology we use in aviation is a disaster. I hate the fact we haven't advanced it since the beginning of man started flying damn it! :(
 
"Line up and wait" is the terminology used in England, the origional English speakers. :lol:

Nice to know you guys are finally catching up. :lol:

They fly "circuits".
We use them to route electricity while in the "pattern".
 
They fly "circuits".
We use them to route electricity while in the "pattern".

We use electrical looms that are laid out in a neat pattern often referred to as circuits. :p

I am so envious of you Waspair, I would love to fly the pattern in the gyro shown in your profile pic.

Take care, fly safe.
 
Well with my thick accent I can completely understand the effort to make things easy to understand.

Well that's odd, you don't type with an accent...:boink:
 
I frequently fly into Canada and Mexico, where ICAO standards of communication have been adopted, and I can tell you from first hand experience, these ICAO controllers are nearly impossible to understand. The Feds push the whole, "standard phraseology" thing, but I've overheard and been issued the most non-standard, unprofessional and unclear instructions from these foreign, ICAO controllers. A recent example with an approach controller at an airport that will remain nameless;
Me: "ABC Approach, Aircraft XYZ at 4000ft, Information Tango." Controller: "Aircraft XYZ, call field in sight for approach." Me: "Aircraft XYZ, field in sight." Controller: "Roger." (2 minutes later) Me: "ABC Approach, Aircraft XYZ, field in sight." Controller: "Roger, I already cleared you for the approach." Me: "What approach and to what runway, sir?" Controller: "02." Me: "Please confirm that Aircraft XYZ is cleared for the visual approach to runway 2." Controller: "Roger, call tower 123.45."
This controller threw standard phraseology out the window during the approach phase of a part 121 Air Carrier operation with nearly 100 paying passengers on board. But rest assured that if I'd descended from my last cleared altitude of 4000ft and, due to confusion from a crappy controller, I wasn't cleared for the approach, I'd get a violation on my pilot record and disciplinary action from my company. The controller would continue to go about his business, eating croissants and cursing those wretched Americans for their inferior flying ability.
So in the future when given instructions to Line up and Wait, I'll respond with Position and Hold.

Check and see what's in that Koolaid before you drink it, people.
 
Sometime ago I heard this communcations between Van Nuys Tower and a Japanese Studend Pilot.

Note: Phonetic spelling used in an attempt to recreate the accent of the student

Student: Von Niz Toe-war, Cessna one two suree west o arr-port fie mile fo ran-din

VNY Tower: Copy Cessna 123, report down wind abeam of the tower for 16R. Do you have (information) Hotel?

Student: Cessna one two suree, no sank-u, on-ree stay fo won hour.

True story!

Wayne
 
Sometime ago I heard this communcations between Van Nuys Tower and a Japanese Studend Pilot.

Note: Phonetic spelling used in an attempt to recreate the accent of the student

Student: Von Niz Toe-war, Cessna one two suree west o arr-port fie mile fo ran-din

VNY Tower: Copy Cessna 123, report down wind abeam of the tower for 16R. Do you have (information) Hotel?

Student: Cessna one two suree, no sank-u, on-ree stay fo won hour.

True story!

Wayne


Now that's funny!

I was on a conference call a few years ago with the FAA. Departments from Washington, Atlanta and Memphis all participated. When ask my opinion about something I responded with “the most logical approach”. That’s as far as I got when someone with the FAA interrupted and said “sir this is the FAA do not attempt to interject logic into this conversation“. Everyone chuckled but I've often wondered if the people laughing were all the non government people on the call.
 
Réálly Rögér? Í swéár tó yűő Í dó hávé á nőtícáblé áccént.......
Ít hás tö bé the kéyböard thán......

Sorry I'm late on this, I do have to work you know!


Pa,,lease... don't try to hide your true accent behind some south eastern polish/Yugoslavian dialect, I forgot what you call it! yetosh or polytechnics or something like that...:boink:

Thanks Gab
I'm glad your on the edge of brilliant, you can never take things to seriously.
Also you think out side the box. which is cool!
when the heck are you gonna fly your gyro?
which is by the way freekin awesome!
 
I think we have to separate two issues:

(1) trying to unify phraseology to one standard that's used world wide.

(2) getting controllers world wide to actually use that standard as intended.

Doing (1) without (2) isn't getting you the whole nine yards. But having (1) is certainly a prerequisite to getting (2).

-- Chris.
 
Sorry I'm late on this, I do have to work you know!


Pa,,lease... don't try to hide your true accent behind some south eastern polish/Yugoslavian dialect, I forgot what you call it! yetosh or polytechnics or something like that...:boink:

Thanks Gab
I'm glad your on the edge of brilliant, you can never take things to seriously.
Also you think out side the box. which is cool!
when the heck are you gonna fly your gyro?
which is by the way freekin awesome!

Ahhhhhhhhhhh Roger I am still in the building phase and working the kinks out. The further I get the more complicated it gets. When you start out it's only a few pieces of aluminum extrusions. Quickly bolt them together and making visible progress. To mount a seat or an engine rail is really not that spectacular. Making brackets 5 times over and finally have them fit is also not that much of a visible progress. So I am working in the background trying to come up with insane ideas for my gyro. :) But I promise I am going to progress a bit more now since the temps dipped below 300 degrees! :) Thanks for the compliment.
 
Gabor- I am sitting on the sidelines cheering on my hero....by the way...I am working hard. I only flew once yesterday...I promise!


Stan
 
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