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  #76  
Old 10-04-2011, 08:30 AM
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txtexans txtexans is offline
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Jon,

Looks like a good job on the pulleys. I noticed that you designed the belt grooves so that every other one appears to be a different size. What type belts are you using? I'm just about ready to start making parts for my Scorpion 1. I won't be ready for drive train parts for some time but I'm planning on using the Subaru engine to power mine.
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  #77  
Old 10-04-2011, 12:20 PM
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The belts that I am using are gates super hc powerband 2/3v750. It is a double banded v belt. It is the same style that rotorway is currently using. I have the 12.25" rotorway secondary and I matched the smaller pulley to it. I did open up the belt groove angle a couple more degrees because of the small pulley diameter.

Subaru power on a single seat scorpion should give you plenty of power. You may even be able to do some heavy lift work. Was it your scorpion that was in the southern rotorcraft newsletter?
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  #78  
Old 10-04-2011, 12:29 PM
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Jon- Really looking nice. It will be very interesting watching your success here. Very impressive.

Stan
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  #79  
Old 10-04-2011, 03:29 PM
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Yes that was mine in the news letter. I have it stripped down to the bare frame now. I stopped working on it for a little while. It was so hot this summer I decided to close in a section of my barn so I can heat and cool it. I almost have that completed. When it's done I'll be back to work on the real project without having to suffer in the heat and cold. I'm ready to start fabricating my cyclic/collective controls. I used the Helicycle as my guide for the design. I modeled my parts in Autodesk Inventor. The assembly models move like they are supposed to. I need to strip the paint of the frame so crack check all the welds with a dye penetrant before I start welding the new mounting brackets to it. And then ... and then ... well you know the rest of this story.
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  #80  
Old 10-10-2011, 01:36 PM
Cmte.Mampian Cmte.Mampian is offline
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Hello Jon. I need a help with regard to the calculation of the Never Exceed Speed ​​(VNE). With respect to his helicopter, I believe that this parameter is specified in the manual came. What about a new project? What data to be taken into consideration? You know the formula to arrive at this VNE?

Thank you.
Cmte.Mampian
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  #81  
Old 10-10-2011, 03:34 PM
Jon Jon is online now
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Hello Cmte. I don't think that there is a VNE formula. From the books that I have read the maximum speed is usually dictated by the amount of vibration that builds up as you fly faster. But if the vibration doesn't slow you down you will start getting into retreating blade stall and the nose of the helicopter will start coming up. That is just a simplified answer based on my understanding of what I have read.
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  #82  
Old 10-10-2011, 03:56 PM
Cmte.Mampian Cmte.Mampian is offline
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His answer was very interesting, and helped me a lot ... trust me. I think first we define the dimensions and other characteristics of the aircraft as an engine, total weight, dimensions of the main rotor blades, etc ... Hence, it would clearly be possible to calculate the VNE.

Thank you.

By the way, when you will post more movies and pictures of their beautiful "creature"?
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  #83  
Old 10-10-2011, 06:10 PM
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Default Hovering again

Well I spoke too soon in an earlier post about my cooling problems being solved. The single radiator setup kept the engine cool for about 5 minutes of hovering but the temp would slowly rise and I shut down when the temp got up to 220. I think that the single radiator would work fine if I was actually doing some flying with a little more than no airspeed. I decided to permanently mount the second radiator and fans and be done with it. I finished that project a couple days ago and so far the problem is solved. With my outside air temp gauge reading 95 I hovered for 20 minutes straight and the water temp never rose above 196. I did have to pay a weight penalty of about 30 pounds though. The new radiator is almost directly below the mast so weight and balance wasn't affected.

Today I hovered and taxied around a total of 30 minutes in 15 minute sessions. Everything seems to be holding together well. I finished all the balancing today too. I stopped making adjustments at .15 ips. I think that I can get the ips down a little more in a hover though. I did practice taking the helicopter to translational lift speed and then stopping, turning around and going back the other way. I only have about 100 yards of open area to play with so I can't get very fast before I have to shut down or run into trees. I don't think that I will have a problem clearing the trees when I do decide to take off for real because as soon as I hit translational lift the helicopter climbs very fast. I found myself at about 30' above the ground before I knew it. I am actually starting to have some fun but burning 10 gph at $3.20 per gallon starts getting expensive after a while. Hopefully the fuel burn will go down after I start forward flights.

Hopefully I will be able to get a camera man to take some video soon.

Here are some pictures that I took today of my practice area and "landing pad". If you look at the first picture you can see my practice field, it is just across the shallow dry creek bed. The second picture is a shot of the adjustable fuel pressure regulator and sending unit, you can also see the second radiator just in front of the engine. The third is another shot of both radiators. The fourth is the new drive pulley. Th fifth is all my gauges. From top then left to right. Air/fuel ratio, fuel pressure, engine tach, rotor speed, airspeed, outside air temp, bottom row, fuel gauge, volts, oil pressure, water temp, manifold pressure, altitude, vertical airspeed, main trans temp, tail trans temp.
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  #84  
Old 10-11-2011, 01:15 AM
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Jon- I love watching your progress. Hovering just never gets tiring to me. Looks like your cooling is under control. Have you considered going to one radiator during the cooler months to save weight? Of course you would have more lift then and this would cancel out some of the weight. Keep up the intersting work. Keep sharing your interesting experiences. Stan
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Helicopters turn air into their runway.

Got kerosene?

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  #85  
Old 10-11-2011, 05:41 AM
Jon Jon is online now
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I have thought about going back to a single radiator when it gets colder around here. We had some 80 degree days here about two weeks ago and the engine temp stayed about 210. I think that I will be fine as it gets colder, although I will probably need a cabin heater then. Actually I just had an idea. Instead of an actual heater I could reverse my cooling fan direction and just run some ducting from the radiator to the cab to get some warm air that way. I may try that.
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  #86  
Old 10-12-2011, 06:19 AM
Cmte.Mampian Cmte.Mampian is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon View Post
Well I spoke too soon in an earlier post about my cooling problems being solved. The single radiator setup kept the engine cool for about 5 minutes of hovering but the temp would slowly rise and I shut down when the temp got up to 220. I think that the single radiator would work fine if I was actually doing some flying with a little more than no airspeed. I decided to permanently mount the second radiator and fans and be done with it. I finished that project a couple days ago and so far the problem is solved. With my outside air temp gauge reading 95 I hovered for 20 minutes straight and the water temp never rose above 196. I did have to pay a weight penalty of about 30 pounds though. The new radiator is almost directly below the mast so weight and balance wasn't affected.

Today I hovered and taxied around a total of 30 minutes in 15 minute sessions. Everything seems to be holding together well. I finished all the balancing today too. I stopped making adjustments at .15 ips. I think that I can get the ips down a little more in a hover though. I did practice taking the helicopter to translational lift speed and then stopping, turning around and going back the other way. I only have about 100 yards of open area to play with so I can't get very fast before I have to shut down or run into trees. I don't think that I will have a problem clearing the trees when I do decide to take off for real because as soon as I hit translational lift the helicopter climbs very fast. I found myself at about 30' above the ground before I knew it. I am actually starting to have some fun but burning 10 gph at $3.20 per gallon starts getting expensive after a while. Hopefully the fuel burn will go down after I start forward flights.

Hopefully I will be able to get a camera man to take some video soon.

Here are some pictures that I took today of my practice area and "landing pad". If you look at the first picture you can see my practice field, it is just across the shallow dry creek bed. The second picture is a shot of the adjustable fuel pressure regulator and sending unit, you can also see the second radiator just in front of the engine. The third is another shot of both radiators. The fourth is the new drive pulley. Th fifth is all my gauges. From top then left to right. Air/fuel ratio, fuel pressure, engine tach, rotor speed, airspeed, outside air temp, bottom row, fuel gauge, volts, oil pressure, water temp, manifold pressure, altitude, vertical airspeed, main trans temp, tail trans temp.
Congratulations, Jon!
It was very well done work ... when you do the video, here puts us in the forum to watch.
Big hug! Luck!

Cmte.Mampian
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  #87  
Old 10-13-2011, 06:54 PM
titanhank titanhank is offline
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hi jon, might i suggest you modify your radiator to a 3 pass system. you can have any local radiator shop cut the tanks off and install blocking dividers so as to create a single unit that the water will pass through the core and cooling airstream three times before exiting the outlet. this will allow the same flow rate but three times the cooling time.

also, i love your rotorhead setup. i know you machined it yourself and it looks like a rotorway copy. i would like to know, are you using the elastomeric thrust bearings from rotorway or something different? where did you get them?

thanks
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  #88  
Old 10-14-2011, 04:23 AM
Jon Jon is online now
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Default Rotor system

Hi Hank. Thanks for the radiator tip. I have a spare F-150 radiator I think that I will try the dividers. I hovered around for 20 minutes yesterday morning at 80 degrees outside and the engine temp stayed at 190 and the gearbox temp didn't get above 200.

As far as the rotor head goes, it is mostly a copy of the Rotorway design. However I have never laid my hands on a Rotorway rotor system so I don't have any of the Rotorway dimensions. All I used to get the designs were pictures. I had no measurements to start with other than the rotor shaft diameter, I didn't even know the shaft length. From there I just machined everything else to fit. It took a lot of work and some trial and error but the finished product works perfectly.

The elastomeric bearings that I use are from Rotorway. I did make several sets of elastomeric bearings myself though before I broke down and paid Rotorway for a set. I tried about six different bearing designs with various levels of success. Two of the sets of bearings actually worked but only for about 30 minutes. I may start working on the bearings again next year, the only problem that I am having is finding a suitable bonding agent. I need a strong adhesive that will bond steel, brass and rubber together but still remain slightly flexible. If I could find that I would be able to make the bearings. I thought that I had some pictures of the bearings that I made but I haven't found them yet.

How is the Helicycle coming along?
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  #89  
Old 10-14-2011, 04:58 AM
titanhank titanhank is offline
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helicycle is going great. i am starting the engine install this week. i am working about 50 hour per week on it.

as far as the glue, i would try 3M DP460. it is the same glue that the blades and doublers are assembled with. the bearings are 20 layers of alternating latex and brass shim stock between the stainless outside washers. the glue does not flex, but each layer of latex flexes a small amount and the brass carries the load. i know waitman made them at one time, but now there is only one guy that makes them for rotorway and he will not sell them to anyone but the factory. i am guessing he also makes them for the helicycle. the reason your bearings only lasted for 30 mins is that the rollers gall up due to the high loads and the short travel of the bearings. if you want to try a bearing in the future, i would suggest an angular contact bearing. this bearing is usually used with two to three bearings stacked on each spindle. this is how robinson does it and they seal them in basically automatic transmission fluid for 2200 hours. here is the link to the bearings.

http://www.timken.com/en-us/products...s/angular.aspx

i would love to stop by sometime and checkout your ship in person sometime. i will be spending 2 months in dallas texas sometime next year. it would be an easy drive over.

fly safe and keep us posted. i want to build a custom ship after i get done with the helicycle.

hank
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  #90  
Old 10-14-2011, 05:24 AM
Jon Jon is online now
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I never tried any type of roller bearings. All the bearings that I made were either delrin composites or the stacked brass, steel and different types of silicone, rubber. and neoprene. I wanted to make an elastomeric bearing that wouldn't be affected by grease. I am using delrin pitch pin bearings in the thrust blocks because I don't want to risk damaging the Rotorway elastomerics.

When you get to Dallas let me know and I will give you directions to our house.

Working 50 hours a week on the helicycle you should be done in record time. I would love to have one.
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