Jon's Day in Traffic Court.

automan1223

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Hey guys,

I know you are a busy bee these days but it was a shame that you missed my "big" trial. I was charged with 58mph in a 45. in Merritt. . For starters the cop did not even know where he was. He put Oriental on the ticket location. Don't laugh. I know a bit about radar, moving radar and decided to fight this ticket because Trooper J A Rink could not cite my speed when he stopped me in the parking lot at Williams in Merritt. He had to go back to his patrol car to look at his radar display to "refresh his memory" . This traffic stop was the strangest stop I have ever had. I was stopped by a cop who had no idea what my speed was. Here is the problem with that. According to case law, NC statutes and the NC Radar Operators Manual an officer is supposed to FIRST develop a tracking history, and form an opinion of the "targets" speed. then confirm that "opinion" with the radar speed meter readout. This is all they do at the Justice academy, this is what they eat, breathe and sleep during their hours at the academy....this is all this trooper is supposed to do for the last 3 years on the job.... There are several other important tasks the officer is supposed to do during the speed estimation function that I do not have space to go into here but the crux of the matter is how can one believe an officer did all these other critical things, and then have forgotten what

1: the speed he estimated you were going ? and

2. The speed readout of the radar .?


I mean, to believe that anything an officer says (after critical lapse of knowledge), would be credible is like selling someone a bridge."trust me".... sure thing.
The trooper insists under oath...."I did all those other critical things but my opinion of your speed and my radar numbers just fell right out of my highly trained noggin". ........I do not think anyone has actually seen this on "Cops" yet.

I had filed a subpoena for certain materials relevant to the case but the DA filed a motion to quash and would give me nothing.. I filed a motion to compel discovery and a motion to dismiss for improper foundation. Today was supposed to be a motions hearing.....I was not prepared for trial lacking certain discovery materials. I told the judge that I could not proceed today because I had not even gotten discovery ! Judge Paul Quinn dismissed both my motions without explaination, and dismissed my motion for a continuance even though my case was not ripe for trial and forced me into his Kangaroo court. I made the best case I could which was a mistake since tipping your hand to the DA for your future attack plan (read appeal) will only make things harder for the future. I was able to get the officer (squirming all the way) to admit that he in fact had to return to his patrol vehicle after stopping me to get my speed. 2. Tell me his brand new patrol car is not equipped with audio or video. 3. Had him admit that he has a digital personal voice recorder in the car, velcro'd to the door which he uses,on stops, but somehow this time he did not take it out for this stop. (now I know why it took him an inordinate amount of time to refresh his memory reading the radar, he was erasing his recorder! ) Can you smell the stink yet ? Of course he lied about the encounter and then lied where ever he could to bolster his case which was very very disappointing . I mean to lie about a traffic stop to this degree puts my faith in any officers statement concerning any other serious matter in serious doubt. AND I mean this from the bottom of my heart. I am guessing the outcome of the Flower murder case (2 hung juries) is the result of the publics experience with this kind of L.E. On a bright note I did get to see Officer DS tell the truth that was not in the states favor and the perp walked on probable cause, (many many charges) Really pissed me off. I know there are good cops out there, somewhere,wink wink, the problem is I never get them to stop me.... [The last trooper I encountered a year ago who wrote me for the same exact charge, had the video tape disappear and then shortly there after so did the officer, word was they moved him like bad catholic clergy to another parish.....]

In addition to other critical paperwork problems getting the officer to admit that he never checked to see if the tuning forks were the ones that were supposed to come with the radar unit, something he has used for 3 years, "they are the ones cause they were in the box" and "the forks returned the stamped speed on the radar unit" was good enough...wrong again.... the judges failure to rule in my favor on over a dozen undispensable points, on this battle that lasted about 3 hours only convinces me to thank god we still have a jury system in this country (for the moment) .

On a positive note I was given points / booby prize by the judge who found me guilty / responsible for the speeding charge but did not have me pay any monetary fines or court costs, (kind of a victory)...... I pleaded to the judge that I would much rather pay the court once than my insurance premium surcharge for the next 39 months. I orally appealed the order on the spot, I have 10 days to withdraw my appeal but having this much fun, at this point it is not about money but the truth. I expect better from NC highway patrol especially over something as minor as a speeding infraction, and I expected more from the Judge Paul Quinn whose charisma, charm and good looks only serves to conceal his contempt for common sense, the truth and the law...unless of course your attorney is the one who got him elected.....

If you do have a case, My fatal mistake was not having a court reporter there to establish all these errors the judge made, or any recording device period, would have made a great family video at the least....ha....Did I mention that they saved my case for last. 299 out of 300 ! God knows the public would not be allowed to hear any of this, It would make the system collapse overnight to see and hear such corruption.....I have to start all over again since none of my issues are appeal-able since with no record, it is like this trial never happened. But now the DA knows my battle plan having exhausted all of my salient points during this fruitless encounter. I should have stopped after the obvious but peppered them with technical points that a law worthy judge would uphold. I am sure they will be much better prepared for next time which is unfortunate in this kind of battle as the deck is already so badly stacked to begin with. I already knew this but figured (at least one fact) the facts would be obvious and the Judge would have to have some semblance of knowing the law, which I provided in memoranda in my motions, especially with all the damaging admissions I was able to get from the officer. My motions to strike, motion to dismiss, motion for a directed verdict for failure of the prosecution to make all the legal points required in a moving radar speeding case....all fruitless. I think they could have put a trained circus animal on the stand as a witness and I would have still been convicted.

In closing I somehow feel that both the DA and the officer felt, at least a little remorseful after I lost. Maybe I was hallucinating, who knows.

I made my points and made them as good as I could. I am no lawyer but I know that if any 12 jurors were to hear this case there is no way his story will ring true and I would have to eventually see some justice. As far as my guilt if the trooper got me going 58 it was in the 55 zone not the 45mph. In addition the troopers vehicle had NO INSPECTION STICKER and his antenna was mounted down low where the sticker would be, on an angle also against operation instructions. With the trial lasting so long it is hard to tell the whole story but you got the high points for now.


J
 
Ticket

Ticket

Jonathan, Would this have happeded had you NOT been speeding?? Do you take ANY responsibility here? Your court case sounds like a circus of horrors though. More oft than not, the only thing an Officer has to go on (other than the flagrancy of the violation) is the recipiants attitude. If you are indeed going to proceed with an appeal, I would strongly suggest that you check the attitude at the door. Like it or not, the unwritten, unspoken underlying foundation of the court system is all supported on attitude. ( It is the huge slab of concrete that all else is based on.) Pi$$ 'em off & - well, you already know that....about fighting city hall & all....I wish the worst thing in life that ever happened to me was only a traffic citation. Save putting your foot in the carburator for when you go 'topside'. Besides, its much harder to serve a ticket up there. $hit happens; suck it up & go fly....& GOOD LUCK!!!
 
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Let me see if I got this right --you were going 58 in a 45 --but you wanted to fight it because you felt the officer was corrupt, the radar was misused and in general you dont like the local judicial system.

I have one question--how fast were you going? I'd bet it WAS 58 not 45 !!
 
I figured.

I figured.

I figured I would get this kind of response from you guys,

If you did not read I admitted to 58 but it was in the 55 zone not the 45, it was a speed zone in a small town and I was slowing down. I know what happened the officers speed was 47 and he was following a truck that was slowing down to turn. I passed them both when they were both stopped if he was clocking me while he was going 47 then he used his radar when I was way way out of that 45 zone. Common sense says this, the evidence says this but whatever,

State troopers write everyone, no warnings, no consideration. I asked the officer very politely 3x how he formed an opinion but he did not get what I was saying.

Is it not convenient that there is no video in some of the cars ? Our tax dollars at work.



J
 
Something I learned a long time ago from a federal prosecutor with more than thirty years experience ... the most dangerous thing in America is a small town cop with a gun.

Based on what you've written here, while you come across as one with some legal experience, the next time you elect to engage in some form of civil action either hire a competent attorney (and far too many are not) or you become far more profecient as a pro se.

tyc
 
The Bad Thing Is The Time U Lose From Work Trying To Fight An Unjust Ticket Will Cost U As Much Or More Than Paying The Ticket So Your Screwed Either Way U Go
 
Jonathan you get no sympathy from me --My wife worked for Az Dept of Public Service for 28 yrs and I have two son in laws that are police officers.
 
After reading this self centered, self serving post it looks more like a spoiled temper tantrum. Sounds like Jonathan got caught while he was slowing down and can’t accept he could possibly be speeding when it’s just so much easier to blame the Cop (always the easiest target), The DA, and the Judge as being corrupt. Yup, I sure buy that.
Woody
 
... looks more like a spoiled temper tantrum. ... Jonathan got caught while he was slowing down ... it’s just so much easier to blame the Cop (always the easiest target), The DA, and the Judge as being corrupt.

That there is some degree of "spoiled tember tantrum" involved, quite possibly. As for blaming the "easiest target", when you stop and think about what the typical cop all too often has to put with on an almost daily basis, the seedy side and worst of human society, one can indeed sympathize with the individual policeman but as for the DA and the Judge being "corrupt", while I agree that's not too likely, it may shock you beyond belief were you to discover how many DA's and Judges throughout this great nation of ours who either corrupt, incompetent or both.

tyc
 
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"If you did not read I admitted to 58 but it was in the 55 zone...."

Jonathan, you just plead guilty to speeding. Even admitting going 1 m.p.h. over the limit is an admission of guilt. It's not called a "speed limit" for nothing.
 
I know you are a busy bee these days but it was a shame that you missed my "big" trial. I was charged with 58mph in a 45. in Merritt. . For starters the cop did not even know where he was. He put Oriental on the ticket location.

You missed the perfect oportunity to beat the ticket in first three sentences of your post! If you weren't there, he couldn't have given you a ticket. That was a gimmee and you blew it!
I actually got off of one myself for the wrong date on the ticket. I was somewhere else that day.
Next time READ THE TICKET!
 
When Ya gonna learn Jonathon,,when Ya say anything here your gonna lose your ass ,,

Some people have hearts and feelings for others.. Some don't have any hearts at all and shouda been aborted before birth, they're evil and power hungry bastards.

If your Rong then your Wrong, and when your RIGHT you get your ass handed to you on a platter..No Good Deed goes without Punishment. I've done this or that,, your stupid because you haven't lived 500 years with experiences in everything imaginable.
They've NEver been caught speeding or done Anything Rong.. Everyone of them ANGELs Jonathon.. Your the ONLY One ever caught and admitted to it publically.

One leg atta time thru your pants just as they have to... Nomatter which leg the lion eats off first, Your the SINNER..

Thats what I enjoy about flying gyro's..

Gravity never changes, just the faces that I have to see when I get back to the ground, and realise why a SeaGull laughs when taking a dump.

Oh Yea Jonathon,, When Ya Gonna Learn..
 
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Jonathan, If you had only had one of those sky cycles you could have popped out the blades and flew away!:D
 
"If you did not read I admitted to 58 but it was in the 55 zone...."

Jonathan, you just plead guilty to speeding. Even admitting going 1 m.p.h. over the limit is an admission of guilt. It's not called a "speed limit" for nothing.

Holy CRAP !

Kenny is back (and without a fanfare.)
Welcome back
Start a new thread and tell us what's going on with you.
 
Look at the wonderful education you received for so little money!!! The judge was a lawyer at one time. He works with other lawyers DALIY as well as OFFICERS. He only has to see you once. You insulted him and his court by trying to represent yourself as being more knowledgeable in HIS PROFESSION. Any errors made by anyone other than you were going to get covered up. The judge will in most cases always support the “system”. Judges enjoy seeing someone like you enter HIS courtroom and try to take on the State Attorney, the Officer of the Law and Himself, the Judge. Can you see where I’m going here? You got bitch-slapped for insulting “the system” and all for the time it took to learn how “the system” works. I applaud the effort to learn. If you enjoyed the education, go back to school and become the best lawyer you can to defend people like you who got a raw deal, or believe they got a raw deal. Think of all the gut-wrenching nights you had as your court date approached. The butterflies in your stomach as your name was called….what a great education!!!!

I have seen things in the Chicago courts that would stun and have stunned the opposing attorney and courtroom…it’s all about money being placed in the correct hands. The attorney’s understand that it is just another day at work, no more and no less. It meant a lot more to you because it was personal…perhaps that was the first mistake made.

There are winners and losers and what does it matter? The important thing is you got to play the game….
 
Look at the wonderful education you received for so little money!!! The judge was a lawyer at one time. He works with other lawyers DALIY as well as OFFICERS. He only has to see you once. You insulted him and his court by trying to represent yourself as being more knowledgeable in HIS PROFESSION. Any errors made by anyone other than you were going to get covered up. The judge will in most cases always support the “system”. Judges enjoy seeing someone like you enter HIS courtroom and try to take on the State Attorney, the Officer of the Law and Himself, the Judge. Can you see where I’m going here? You got bitch-slapped for insulting “the system” and all for the time it took to learn how “the system” works. I applaud the effort to learn. If you enjoyed the education, go back to school and become the best lawyer you can to defend people like you who got a raw deal, or believe they got a raw deal. Think of all the gut-wrenching nights you had as your court date approached. The butterflies in your stomach as your name was called….what a great education!!!!

I have seen things in the Chicago courts that would stun and have stunned the opposing attorney and courtroom…it’s all about money being placed in the correct hands. The attorney’s understand that it is just another day at work, no more and no less. It meant a lot more to you because it was personal…perhaps that was the first mistake made.

There are winners and losers and what does it matter? The important thing is you got to play the game….
Now here is a voice of experience talking!
 
Jonathan, Ignore these guys that pretend they have never broken a single rule to the slightest degree. Just be glad that you could afford the time to go stand up for your rights! I have personally been pulled over by the police/sheriff in two different counties in the last six months. They both tried to tell me I was driving faster than I actually was! They were nice about it and niether one tazed me or gave me a ticket but, the truth is the truth! You seem like a law abiding citizen to me. If the cop was driving a flying saucer with lights and sirens then I might expect you to give him an attitude, otherwise you did the right thing!
 
Sorry If I gave you the wrong impression.
I don't think in terms of fighting them, I deserve 100's maybe 1000's of tickets that I never got caught for when I was young.
I used to drive cars designed to be driven 180 mph on the autobahn, late at night with no one around on freeways designed by US engineers to be driven at 120 mph because at the time they were designed cars speed and safety were increasing so fast that's what they expected that would be the speed we were driving.
So when I get a ticket I deserve it. It's never been for as little as 1 mile over the limit, so in my case it's not the officers fault.
I say good morning and mean it!
No more upset than I would get at the amusement park at the 'ticket taker' for the roller coaster ride.
I like to speed, I'll just pay for the Privilege without upsetting my happiness meter or his.
The problem I have is the cop's are shaking with adrenalin from having to go over 130+ to catch me because I'm going so fast and they are usually stopped. They seem to be upset that I’m not upset for getting a ticket or that I trying to be a smart ass by being genuinely friendly.
All but this last Thanksgiving driving my mother’s car and her to San Fran. After 12 hours of driving, (I hate to drive now) at 2 AM got 'lit up' (red lighted) doing 90 in a 65.
Cop comes to the window I say good morning officer. He says lic and reg. and do you know how fast you were going? Yes officer when you light me up I was going 90. He shines the light on my 84 years old mother and says why. I say I’m getting tired been driving 12 hrs for SD only 20 min’s away and was not paying any attention to speed just getting there.
He walks back to his car. I’m waiting to sign the ticket, truly unaffected. He comes back and says I’m going to let you off with a warning (Never happen before) because I just got yelled at from a lier for 30 min’s by a guy who called me every name in the book, and I would just like to reward you and make me feel good about myself for you being so honest and friendly.

I never got a ticket I didn’t deserve so I don’t know what that would feel like, in my case I own for too many they never caught me for.

I just have a lot of time in court (courtroom presentations, not an attorney) and recognized the way the judge and attorney's think in his explanation.
Hey if it makes you happy to fight, then fight.
I was also impress by his lay skills at the trial.
John
 
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