The Great Essex Ethanol Validation

Ethanol Myths

Ethanol Myths

As a professional repair technician I get tired of all the lies and disinfo coming from the folks that had no problem sticking it up your asses when fuel was over 4 bucks a gallon. Ethanol is a good fuel, a clean burning fuel and is RENEWABLE ! Stick that in drill in your back pocket because we would solve a LOT of problems if the oil industry lost its choke hold on the world.

Ethanol will not

Blow up your car,
Melt fuel injectors
destroy your engine.

If your stuff broke chances are you were overdue for maintenance anyway.

It does not cause smog any more than the heavy fuels you are already burning.

The only exception to this is 2 cycle engines that have oil mixed with the fuel. I am CERTAIN you could find a suitable oil to mix with the ethanol and it would work just fine but for now I would forgo the 100 to 1 mixing ratios of synthetic snake oil.

Just watch the attacks on ethanol continue as they are the only real threat to big oil and while solar, wind and wave power is viable it is not going to repower your gyro or auto anytime soon. In the mean time like I said after the messiah was elected, watch oil come down, the tarp funds repower the financial markets that crashed when oil fell from its highs in July 2008. Once the pump is reprimed the cost of oil will take off again, recession be damned !

J


J
 
You forgot it has a lower BTU content than gasoline and takes more to do the same thing there fore cost more to get there...
I ran the crap for over 8 months in my 07 and fuel mileage was flat out terrible on e 85, my big PU went from 16 miles per to 10 in town as I said the stuff is crap!!!
It will also melt the plastic parts in the carburetors in older cars had that happen when they first introduced the stuff to me also so if you drive a classic car beware.... Similar dammage can be expected in some lawn mowers....
 
It is almost 30% the difference . . .when gasoline is expensive they go for ethanol, always using GNV as preference for savings. But you don´t have that yet, you bunch of know-it-alls. :D
And yes . . .some materials are not suitable, specially older cars, most japanese and europeans are made to resist.
More power and faster cars they are with ethanol.
also they drip water from the exaust all the time like a fawcett, that alone needs a special muffler.
When you are driving behind a car, it smells good, no smoke and less polution.
Kick and scream all you want, we have 30 years ahead of you, resistence is futile you will get drunk! :D
Stop been silly, get acultured, it does not hurt and at the end you have an option, to the future and beyond or back to your cave! :D
Heron
 
Heron......Sugar cane Ethanol and Corn Ethanol are 2 very different things!
Sugar cane yields more Ethanol per bushel, plus it is about a 30 to 1 gain over the energy used to produce it. Corn is a 1 to 1 yield it takes the same amount of energy to distill it as you get from it, it is a wash, Burning Fuel to convert food into fuel is asinine.
Now with fuel prices down the Ethanol industry is suffering, so they are lobbying to get it increased to a 15% blend.
If you are a corn farmer ethanol is great, other than that it is the wrong answer here, as sugar cane does not grow well in the US, except in Hawaii, and hawaii does not have enough land area to make it a viable crop for fuel.
It just does not have the BTU energy that gasoline has. Plus all the other negatives.

The Gov speaks out both sides of their mouth when they mandate increased fuel MPG and then mandate Ethanol which reduces gas mileage.

Ethanol mixed with Gasoline spews out many different emissions than straight Ethanol or straight gasoline, so it is a big scam.

http://cei.org/gencon/019,05432.cfm

http://www.wallstreetsurvivor.com/CS/forums/t/29358.aspx

http://www.fuel-testers.com/ethanol_problems_damage.html

http://www.slate.com/id/2122961/
 
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As a professional repair technician I get tired of all the lies and disinfo coming from the folks that had no problem sticking it up your asses when fuel was over 4 bucks a gallon. Ethanol is a good fuel, a clean burning fuel and is RENEWABLE ! Stick that in drill in your back pocket because we would solve a LOT of problems if the oil industry lost its choke hold on the world.

Ethanol will not

Blow up your car,
Melt fuel injectors
destroy your engine.

If your stuff broke chances are you were overdue for maintenance anyway.

It does not cause smog any more than the heavy fuels you are already burning.

The only exception to this is 2 cycle engines that have oil mixed with the fuel. I am CERTAIN you could find a suitable oil to mix with the ethanol and it would work just fine but for now I would forgo the 100 to 1 mixing ratios of synthetic snake oil.

Just watch the attacks on ethanol continue as they are the only real threat to big oil and while solar, wind and wave power is viable it is not going to repower your gyro or auto anytime soon. In the mean time like I said after the messiah was elected, watch oil come down, the tarp funds repower the financial markets that crashed when oil fell from its highs in July 2008. Once the pump is reprimed the cost of oil will take off again, recession be damned !

J


J

Be careful with your advice, as a professional repair technician you should know that most 2 strokes will NOT be safe with that juice..!
 
It is almost 30% the difference . . .when gasoline is expensive they go for ethanol, always using GNV as preference for savings. But you don´t have that yet, you bunch of know-it-alls. :D
And yes . . .some materials are not suitable, specially older cars, most japanese and europeans are made to resist.
More power and faster cars they are with ethanol.
also they drip water from the exaust all the time like a fawcett, that alone needs a special muffler.
When you are driving behind a car, it smells good, no smoke and less polution.
Kick and scream all you want, we have 30 years ahead of you, resistence is futile you will get drunk! :D
Stop been silly, get acultured, it does not hurt and at the end you have an option, to the future and beyond or back to your cave! :D
Heron




Hats off to Brazil ..? 45,000 square kilometers (17,374 square miles) of land was used for the production of sugar cane for ethanol production - and most of this was for internal use. This is a larger land area than the entire country of Denmark. But the biggest problem with ethanol is that it steals vast swaths of land that might be better used for growing food. Back to a cave..!

This is not just hype , it's dangerous, delusional bull$hit. Ethanol doesn't burn cleaner than gasoline, nor is it cheaper.

Gasoline substitute, NO. Its energy density is one-third less than gasoline, which means you have to burn more of it to get the same amount of power.

The US ethanol con is largely a tribute to the political muscle of a single company: agribusiness giant Archer Daniels Midland.

Even EPA admits that ethanol produces more nitrogen oxides and hydrocarbons (components of smog) than regular gas.

It has long been known that many small engines aren't designed to run on ethanol and, in fact, are destroyed by them.

E10 gas can cause engine damage, poor performance, wear-down parts and lower mpg.

Higher-ethanol fuel blends may compromise lifetime performance of non-flex fuel vehicles.
 
I have an idea, If I can get my '87 honda CRX running good, it started stalling yesterday after sitting for about a month, here in the very humid southeast.

Anyhow, I'll clean it out and run tank of 100ll through it and check the mileage, then I'll run a tank of the crappy bended junk through it and see what the difference is.
the car is non-cat and the 02 sensor is broken anyhow. I have had as high as 42 mpg with this car but lately all I can get is 35mpg.
 
It was a headwind for the ethanol test!!!!

***Just practicing***
 
I just received this from the FAA:

FAAST Blast
Notice Number: NOTC1684


FAAST Blast — May 26, 2009

Biweekly FAA Aviation News update



Babbitt Gets Green Light As FAA Administrator

... (Excluded) ...



Has Your Airplane Been Drinking?

We surely hope not. While the cost-savings of using autogas in your aircraft may be enticing, it is important to ensure it doesn’t contain ethanol, a mix that can be extremely dangerous inside your engine. Among the primary concerns for using ethanol in airplanes not designed for its use are vapor lock, incompatibility with certain engine parts, and its tendency to absorb water. To learn more about the dangers of using ethanol in GA aircraft, see Peter Rouse’s article “Why Does My Airplane Smell Like It Has Been Drinking?” in the May/June 2009 issue of FAA Aviation News. For a live presentation on this important topic, you can catch Rouse at the Virginia Regional Festival of Flight in Suffolk, Virginia, May 30 and 31. The important thing to remember: The aircraft owner is ultimately responsible for determining autogas does not contain ethanol.
 
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When we talk, we should think we are all in the same level of intelligence.
So . . .no bad ethanol in discussion here.
It will take time for you to get it going right!
No, our cars don´t start right away, they do have a gas jug and pump for quick start.
It does burn cleaner, it does create social problems with land usage.
I am against ilimited farming, sent report to my area urging the mayors and councils to create laws on the matter.
Willie Nelson came down and imported the bio-diesel to help farmers, sugar cane could be an option.
Both Our Govt are full of croocks . . .no news here!
All alternate fuels must have a cycle, later on we are going to be in the hands of larger corporations for energy, remember Blade Runner or Robot Cop?
Haiti is dying right under your noses, go for it!
Today, Israeli technology is in place, direct injetion of nutrients by computer control.
A little plastic tube is inserted in the roots, the soil is just for holding it up.
I live in an ocean of sugar cane, some impressive areas. Problems are there, so is the money to fix them.
Open up to progress and embrace socioenviromentalism.
Hey! maybe you will die thirsty before we can fix the ethanol problem . . . :eek:
Heron
 
Scott, get your oxygen sensor replaced; if you really have one - it tells the computer whether the exhaust is rich or lean, so the computer can tune the mix for best mileage/power.

If it's a '87, it might NOT have an oxygen sensor. Does the carb have a BUNCH of vacuum tubes running from it? If so, you probably don't have a computer or a sensor.

If you do have a computer and sensor, a busted sensor will hurt your mileage.
 
02 ?

02 ?

Scott,

Without the O2 the engine will not run well. Without mixture control closed loop is out the window.



I have an idea, If I can get my '87 honda CRX running good, it started stalling yesterday after sitting for about a month, here in the very humid southeast.

Anyhow, I'll clean it out and run tank of 100ll through it and check the mileage, then I'll run a tank of the crappy bended junk through it and see what the difference is.
the car is non-cat and the 02 sensor is broken anyhow. I have had as high as 42 mpg with this car but lately all I can get is 35mpg.
 
Facts or opinion ?

Facts or opinion ?

Hats off to Brazil ..? 45,000 square kilometers (17,374 square miles) of land was used for the production of sugar cane for ethanol production - and most of this was for internal use. This is a larger land area than the entire country of Denmark. But the biggest problem with ethanol is that it steals vast swaths of land that might be better used for growing food. Back to a cave..!

This is not just hype , it's dangerous, delusional bull$hit. Ethanol doesn't burn cleaner than gasoline, nor is it cheaper.

Ethanol, or the E 85 blend has an octane rating of 105. Running high octane fuel in low compression smog engines is what causes the smog.

Gasoline substitute, NO. Its energy density is one-third less than gasoline, which means you have to burn more of it to get the same amount of power.

As a renewable resource do you want to keep putting your and your kids future in the hands of radical middle eastern countries ?


The US ethanol con is largely a tribute to the political muscle of a single company: agribusiness giant Archer Daniels Midland.

I would much rather support local farmers than shed American blood in the sand for what ?


Even EPA admits that ethanol produces more nitrogen oxides and hydrocarbons (components of smog) than regular gas.

Again, fine tuning of engine components could render this a moot issue.Since when do you believe everything the epa has to say ?

It has long been known that many small engines aren't designed to run on ethanol and, in fact, are destroyed by them.

You can get fuel system and carb parts plated to accept high levels of ethanol. Most fuel systems from 1990 onward are plastic anyway which means they are safe from corrosion.

E10 gas can cause engine damage, poor performance, wear-down parts and lower mpg.

Higher-ethanol fuel blends may compromise lifetime performance of non-flex fuel vehicles.

If other countries can do it why can't America ?

J
 
If other countries can do it why can't America ?
Look at the diesels in Europe, or this.

You know the answer....our government.

About the o2 sensor on the Honda, it is carbureted and has no computer I think that the O2 sensor is vestigial like an appendix. :) It did get 42 MPG with the sensor broken, no one has it local, I have to order it online but have been too absent minded to get one.
 
All of the Baddest fastest race cars (top fuel,top alcohol, F1, F2, Indy car, sprint car and others)in the world run on ethtenol or alcohol. Reasons being lower engine temp, lower cht,lower egt, get away with extermely high compression ratio (in excess of 22:1 with supercharger or turbo) ,Safety lower flash point of fuel, plus the ability of adding oxygen enhancers(nitromethane and others). Two strokes work great with it with racing castor oil. Far as flying with it I don't know. With my experience racing with it it's high maintanace you need to drain the fuel, flush fuel pumps injection systems or carbs everytime you use it, If you leave it in the fuel system it's highly corrossive. Also sensitive to temp, barometric pressure and other atmosphiric conditions and that's on the ground at a race track not trying to fly it(yes we are trying to fly it but it's not supposed to leave the ground) But far as aviation use It will be high maitanance and I wouldn't want to be the test pilot not that it wouldn't work.I'm talking the pure stuff not mixed with gasoline
 
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not quite.

not quite.

Scott,

If the car has an o2 sensor then it HAS a computer / ECM for engine management duties ! The main purpose for the o2 is closed loop feedback for the mixture control which means it only puts in enough fuel to run the engine [ at an average of 14.7:1 air/fuel mixture]. Without a proper o2 signal (which is a varying 0 to 1 volt dc signal) The computer will stop managing the mixture control solenoid in the carb and stay in open loop.

EFI does this by varying the pulse width or "on" time of the fuel injectors.

Once the computer locks out the m/c control solenoid you are on whatever the factory set the fuel mix open loop at. Given its a honda means it will most likely run quite well most of the time but as you can seen the circus of vacuum hoses and lines everywhere I can guarantee you that it was not something they just "added for looks". Hondas esp. early pre efi builds are problematic with fuel system and emission issues. Carbon build up in the intake and behind the intake valves may cause the engine to run artificially lean and misfire at idle or at the far end of the closed loop mc control and the only way to correct that is to either clean out the carbon or knock out the block off plug at the base of the carb and manually adjust the base idle mix screw like found on most pre emission control carbs. Careful where you drill and grind you do not want to crack the base of the carb ! However high mileage engines run like a charm after you recalibrate the base mix !

My advice is to Fix that o2, if the mc solenoid is not toast....if it is just a single wire then you can get a cheapo univeral o2 sensor for around 20 bucks and just splice the wire in. If it is a 2 wire or more I can look up and see what the extra wires are doing. 99 % of the o2 sensors ground through the sensor body, or the plug threads. The extra wires are usually for o2 heater operation for quick operation when cold. As far as I know it should only be a 1 wire on anything 91 and earlier. California calibrations might be an exception.

I make you a bet with the o2 working you might get 45 mpg !

As for Bking:

Top fuel uses METHANOL which is HIGHLY corrosive and volatile !

Any gasoline when left in the fuel system decays and will sludge things up.

Shelf life of todays gas is about 2 weeks.

J
 
When we had the so called polution control in Florida, I use to cheat them.
Pull a vacuum hose, add two litters of alchool in a low tank and by the time you are gettin to the front line you will be burning 00.
All my cars passed inspection. My New Yorkers 8 always did very low emissions number without the trick.
So . . .where is the problem with alchool if I could not pass on gasoline alone?
No hearsay, not guided research, just plain facts in real life.
I have been driving alchool since the 70´s, no big problems.
NOw get out of your trench and go embrace the enemy!
Heron
 
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