Magni M16 v the rest

Mike G

Junior Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2005
Messages
1,917
Location
Lillebonne France
Aircraft
Owned Magni M16 now ELA 07
Total Flight Time
550FW + 500 gyro
I'm a new kid on the block, I joined recently and congratulate you all on a splendid forum.

I recently did a conversion to gyro flying in France (I'm a Brit living, working, flying and other things ending in "ing" in France).
My conversion from fixed wing (550 hours including 150 helicopter) to gyro was in an M16 Magni and included dual in 3 M16's one being the Magni prototype with a fully encosed cockpit. I'm hooked.

I've recently been offered a Magni with a new chassis and rotor head (post accident rebuild by Magni agent) a 500 hour 914S and revised prop. It's one of the gyros I flew and I found it vibrated a bit, we even tried to balance the rotor. The owner has decided to change the blades to resolve the vibration problem so the offer includes a new set of blades.

The price for this package of joy is 60% of the price of a brand new M16 including taxes. In France the M16 is sold as a complete machine (not a kit like in the US) and is rated as an Ultra light Machine.

I'm well aware that, like most pilots, I've fallen in love with the machine I learned on and ask the forum for their honest opinions of the M16 compared to equivalent gyros. I'm hoping that this will help me be more pragmatic and less misty eyed.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

Mike G
 
I have flown the Magni along with a few other gyro's. If I could afford it I would jump at the chance to own a Magni.
 
Mike, due to the cost, especially here in the states, there won't be as many fliers familiar with the Magni as most other brands, but eerything we hear is that it is a great, stable, high-quality machine.

I'd suspect the only concerns most readers of your post will have is the risks involved with the rebuild after the wreck. If it were me, I'd take that 60 per cent, borrow the other 40, and get a new one.

But, that's just me!
 
I would be interested in why that one crashed. It should tell you something. But I have not heard of any problems with Magni, I believe it is the Caddalic of gyros and the cost is as well.
 
IMHO...an open air gyro cannot be the Cadillac of gyros. :D


Cheers :)
 
well Harry what would you pick as the primere gyro, and Magni do have canopys as well as a new enclosed model
 
I had a chance to fly Greg Gremmenger's Magni at Mentone a couple of years ago. Very solid stable machine. Heavier stick forces than my single seat experience but about the same as most 2 seaters I've flown. A class act!

Mike
 
Thank you guys for the input, it confirms my very limited experience with the Magni. I'll take Mark's advice and get more details re the crash.
Paul, it's a nice idea to borrow the 40% but I'd already be borrowing most of the 60% if I buy this machine.
I'll let you know if I find the courage and the cash.

Mike G
 
Hi Mike

Buy a RAF they are not that expensive as the Magni and much nicer gyro to fly. It will maybe take you a couple of hours longer in training than a Magni but will be worth your while and the money you spent.

You are sure to get a lot of negative posts about the RAF and will also get a lot of guy's telling you it is a piece of ****, but do yourself a favor and go and fly in one and them make your own decision.


Regards

Eben Mocke JNR
 
Hi Mike

Buy a RAF they are not that expensive as the Magni and much nicer gyro to fly. It will maybe take you a couple of hours longer in training than a Magni but will be worth your while and the money you spent.

You are sure to get a lot of negative posts about the RAF and will also get a lot of guy's telling you it is a piece of ****, but do yourself a favor and go and fly in one and then make your own decision.

Regards

Eben Mocke JNR
 
Magni

Magni

Mike

You probably won't be able to fly an RAF in France as it wouldn't meet the Ultralight rules (too heavy). There are a quite a few in the UK, but the CAA may be taking some action on them soon (they're about to mandate some mods / limitations on the single-seat fleet, and will be looking at the 2-seaters next).

I trained on a VPM (the forerunner to the Magni) and thought it was great. There are a couple of 914-powered VPM-M16s in the UK with well over a thousand hours on each, plus more appearing with Rotax and Subaru conversions.

60% of the new price sounds like a bargain. We can't buy Magnis in the UK (yet), and the old VPMs sell at a premium as a result.

Steve
 
SARAF said:
...Buy a RAF they are not that expensive as the Magni and much nicer gyro to fly. It will maybe take you a couple of hours longer in training than a Magni but will be worth your while and the money you spent...
At first I thought this guy was being cynical, but it appears he believes in what he is saying... Amazing!.

Udi
 
I have flown 3 different RAFs and one Magni. I thought that the Magni was much nicer and very easy to fly. It was particularly smooth and stable. The Magni was very nice in a steep bank. The RAFs were also nice, but I was not able to manage pitch as well and they seemed more affected by wind gusts. One had a horizantal stabilizer, one had a Stabilator and one had neither. I have also flown a Groen Brothers modified RAF and it seemed to fly very nicely and handled thermals well. I have flown 2 different SparrowHawks and I liked them a lot, very easy to fly and very tolerent of enviromental disruptions. Although they lack the excitement of an open aircraft they were a lot of fun. Thank you, Vance
 
" At first I thought this guy was being cynical, but it appears he believes in what he is saying... Amazing!. "

Udi :

That is not Amazing it is stunning!

I also have flown several RAF's, in fact I own one. The unmodified RAF 2000 is in my opinion a death trap.

I also flew with Greg in his Magni a few years ago at Bensen Days, I found the Magni not only to be stable in all axes but a very well built and designed machine.

Greg is one of the best instructors out there and a class act.

Chuck E.
 
UDI , I think Mike will come to the right decision. I don't think many people would argue that RAF is a better gyro than the Magni. But I would like to hear some reports on any Magni crashes and their causes. Maybe a new thread?
 
Mark - no aircraft is immune to crashes, Magni included. The pilot is usually the weak link. There was one fatal accident in a Magni that I know of. Nobody knows for sure the real cause of that accident (the dead can't talk), but it appears that the very experienced (Italian) Boeing 747 captain/aerobatic pilot, who was a good friend of the owner of this particular Magni, forgot he was flying a gyro, and made a FW aerobatic maneuver close to the ground. This is how Greg G reported this accident. There are probably hundreds of Magnis flying in Europe and it appears they have a very good safety record.

Udi
 
Thank you all for your experiences and opinions.

I'm sure Steve is right and I can't fly a RAF in France under the ultra light rules, which are basically 122 maximum HP and 450 kg (990lb) max all up weight for a two place gyro.

I'm still trying to organise the finance.

Mike G
 
I wish the FAA would adopt France's UL restrictions. 990 lbs, that's incredible. And I thought we were an aviation friendly country.
 
Why would you want that restriction 990. The FAA give us one better 1320 Sport aircraft. We the USA need to say the way we are and let the Franch do what they want.
 
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