anyone use an ULTRAPROP?

[scottessex]

Just wondering if anyone has had any experience with ultraprops.
I have a warpdrive, I have talked to people with powerfins and Ivo's,

Would I get much more performance with a four blade or is it just extra weight?

I have been trying to read and understand all this propeller theory stuff. ;)

[KenSandyEggo]

"Just wondering if anyone has had any experience with ultraprops."

Not me.

[CLS447]

I flew one for years on my 447 AC. When I dinged the tips I had to trim off an inch. I felt I had lost too much, so I bought another one. (60" 4 blade ). I was told that they were the least efficient prop you can get? So I tried a 3 blade Warp. I got nothing more out of it than my Ultra but because of the extra weight it made my 447 harder to pull start, so I sent back the Warp.(free trial). Continued to use the Ultra. It was simple & light & with the 13 degree pitch blocks I was getting 6250 RPM's. Perfect!

In my lifelong search for more thrust to keep up with my lifelong weight gain, I bought & tried an IVO. It seemed to work better & what a breeze to adjust! So that is what I fly now.

I still think that the Ultra is a good prop. 4 blades made it really smooth & it still is a bargain.

On my new Sub machine I ended up with a Warp due to value. I had considered Powerfin, but he wanted me to use a 5 blade! I called IVO they wanted me to use their setup that cost more than $1000 !

If Dave D is right , then when I get my Prince it will be like adding N2O! So it can only get better, but for now I will let you know how my Warp is working. If I remember correctly I am at 13 degrees of pitch with a 68" WArp. With a Souza redrive( forgot ratio ) & my EA-81 is turning 5120 at full throttle. I will probably back it down 1 degree to get 5200. It feels like a rocketship compared to my 447! There's my 2 cents for what it's worth. PS How are my numbers compared to other SUB's turning 68" ers?

[gyropilot]

If Dave D is right , then when I get my Prince it will be like adding N2O!Has anyone tried using N2O injection on a Rotax 503 yet? :)

John L.

[KenSandyEggo]

No, but I'm thinking of this!


http://www.atpcoinc.com/index.html :eek:

[CLS447]

I have it on my Harley, They only want it injected at full throttle so there is a microswitch on my carb that will only let the solenoid open at full throttle. I usually won't use it till 3rd gear. It makes you reach redline quicker, but don't over rev!

On your prop, without adding pitch, It would probably over rev. No good.

My brother had it on his older 532 powered Sea-doo watercraft. No throttle switch. He would hit it right out of the hole! Blew his engine. Gotta read directions......

[Ralph]

In my opinion, the UltraProp is a poor choice for any gyro:

(1) The prop is very heavy. In flight, it behaves live a gyroscope that is actually resisting control inputs in pitch and yaw. Lighter props thus appear to handle better.

(2) The prop generates a lot of prop noise compared to any other I have used.

(3) I consider its efficiency to be low and you will see that if you measure static thrus with various props.

Ralph

[barnstorm2]

Chris,

Do you know what the gearbox ratio is on your 447?

Which IVO do you use at what pitch? Did it help alot?

[PW_Plack]

Ken,

I, too, was excited to see the "affordable" turbine ready to hit the market, but go to the "Products" link where they have the specifications, and you may be disappointed. At 3050 RPM they claim 240 HP, but only 600 pounds of thrust, about what you can get with a hopped up Soob, and at more than twice the fuel consumption:

www.disappointing_thrust.com (http://www.atpcoinc.com/Pages/Products.html)

The May issue of Popular Mechanics has an article on a nuclear aircraft powerplant under development by the Pentagon, that may one day find its way into civilian use. Now THAT would be the ticket for long, unrefueled mercenary missions!

[scottessex]

I am using a 60" warp right now, it may be the best for the buck for me right now, I thought the ultra props were lighter?

[CLS447]

Tim, I have a 2.58-1 B . I never had to use a protractor with the IVO, so I can't tell you the pitch. I set it up using the tach. 6250 Max RPM. 1 center bolt adjusts all three blades at once. It seemed to work fine, can't really give any proof of performance. So I just stuck with it. Can't say that it was much better but I like it. 3 blade 60" , cost me about $500.

[barnstorm2]

Chris,

If you ever get a chance to do a static thrust test please tell me the results so I can compare. I am very happy with my Ultraprop but still I would pay $500 for some more climb abilty. When the temp goes up and I have a full tank of gas ( along with my increasing body weight ) I can hardly climb worth a darn. I am worried that once I start using my new seat tank I wont be able to get safely airborne.


In a few weeks I am going to try the new pitch blocks you sent me to see if it helps. My Tach if correct shows I am making 6800RPM.

[CLS447]

Tim, aren't you following the rotorblade threads? According to Mark you can double your HP by getting rid of your Skywheels & replacing them with DW's !!!! I really want to try a set. They are also much lighter. Let me know if you try a set first. I'm serious!

The first time I met Doug S. of Air Command at SnF 2000 ,He said " Are you still flying them old boat anchors?".(Skywheels) He said the DW's would"FLY CIRCLES " around them. I thought he was just trying to sell me something else. I really am gonna have to find out for myself.

If you could increase your performance by getting some DW's would you do that?

After hearing about John's success story, I'm really thinking this over. Mike B. is right, that is the best advertising you can get!!!

[barnstorm2]

Chris,

Although I am willing to scrape up money for a new prob or even better a good used prop a set of blades is more than I can afford in the short term. After the two place is all finished.. then I might be able to swing something that is a few grand.

If a new prop or set of pitch blocks can give me a boost now, then they will help even more if I eventually get DWs.

[docjon]

I used dragon wings on my gyro for about 20 hrs. I did like the performance but the ability to adjust the blades is sorely lacking. No lateral adjustment and you have to use beer can shims under the teeter block to adjust the
tracking. Much prefered the smoothness of the Skywheels even though
they had slightly less perf. Recently went to Sport rotors from
Sport Copter in 25' length. Extremely adjustable. When I got them all I had
to do was mount them and fly. Already smooth, balanced and tracked.
I got the 8" cord blades that weight about 65 lbs. I would recommend the
blades to anyone. The 7" cord comes in at $2000 and the 8" are $3000.
No, I am not a rep for Sport Copter. Just think their product is excelent.

[KenSandyEggo]

Paul P., who cares about the cost, the thrust and the fuel consumption? It's the noise, my man. Nothing else sounds like a turbine.

[rehler]

docjon,

Good input. Thanks.

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