New Board ? [Archive] - Rotary Wing Forum

gyroplanes

07-24-2005, 11:10 PM

Thumpernator

07-25-2005, 09:22 AM

Thanks, Tom. This years election was a tough one. It was VERY hard to choose only three.

I hope those that didn't make it this year, will try again next year.

KenSandyEggo

07-25-2005, 11:49 AM

So Gary's not going to run for president again? What about his position as one of the 2 owners of the airport? I have no idea if he would ever do it, but he could drop out of the PRA completely and he and Glenn could sell the airport to the highest bidder and put the moneys in their pockets or donate it to some other "non-profit" organization where they draw fat salaries every year. The fact that this possibility exists is rotten to the core. We members should not be in such a vulnerable position after having paid for the airport. Contracts are drawn up every day for numerous good reasons. When you're talking about a valuable asset as the airport, we shouldn't have to rely on, "Oh, he (they) would never do anything like that." Fine. Then put it in writing and give us our airport back. There is not one even slim reason why the members of PRA should not own the airport that they paid for and continue to pay for. The Mentone Board has never had the courtesy to explain why they hid the set-up from the members for years and years. If everything was above-board, why all the secrecy and yes, outright bull**** about who owned the airport for so long? It never came to light until someone exposed the set-up.

I sent in my dues on the possibility that some new blood in the form of Steve and Jim would get elected to the board. It happened and I have to stick around to see if this will make a difference. Otherwise, I had fully intended to quit helping pay for an airport with such dubious ownership.

RayPierce

07-25-2005, 02:16 PM

And Ernie Boyette.

Officers were re-elected in the same positions.
Gary announced he would not accept nomination for Presidency next year.
Tim Blackwell is PRA Chapter Coordinator.
First 6 mos of 2005, PRA is in the black.
Membership is holding steady.
$18,000 balance on PRA Mentone airport.
BOD voted to endorse ASTM standards in part.

Dave, we miss you.

[QUOTEJim Mayfield, Steve McGowen (sp), And I can't remember number three.[/QUOTE]

I'm afraid to go outside now... I voted for all three of them. That's never happened with me before!

Timchick

07-25-2005, 08:25 PM

Ray,
Maybe you should buy a lottery ticket before it wears off.

KenSandyEggo

07-26-2005, 12:58 AM

If any of us had any good luck at all, we probably wouldn't be involved with gyro$.

automan1223

07-26-2005, 06:08 AM

2 years ago I heard about the rumblings about this airport dealing. Then I said, ok it will get worked out, so I sent in my dues again, finally everything maxie, dan and jamie were saying was finally put on paper by the real owners. (not pra membership) ..the final straw....Ron Awad was going to get a paper during bensen days that said pra members owned the airport, I held off renewing my membership because of what we were being told all along and nothing but insults and silence were thrown at those who would question the hierachy.

So Gyro Ron comes back with a piece of paper that says exactly what we all thought it would say,......they still own the airport, the owners will give it to another non profit if they give it away. (essentially).

Ken I would save my money. 2 years and nothing but being proven right. They say we are / were the stupid ones but I am still waiting for apologies from those critics that said we were nuts in the first place, of course pra owns the airport. NOT!

Mediators are not going to "work this out" there is just too much money and assets involved.

3 board members stepped down after time and time again being unable to get the board to even FOLLOW THEIR OWN BYLAWS. If I cannot trust you with the little stuff then WHY THE FRICK WOULD I TRUST YOU WITH THE LARGE STUFF. ?

only a fool with pipe dreams would believe in todays world a setup to screw you would not end up in a screwing.

Jonathan

barnstorm2

07-26-2005, 08:29 AM

Thanks Tom!

Doug Riley

07-26-2005, 09:35 AM

Guys, don't get too over-wrought about the airport thing. I don't know Gary even to say "hi" to and I've never had any part in PRA's governance, but the nominal owners are not as free to sell as it may appear. If PRA provided the money (and even the name) of the sister corp. that actually owns the field, I think it's rather clear that the arrangement is in fact a trust for the benefit of PRA. I believe a court would so rule.

That would limit the ability of the nominal owners to sell the place for their own account -- even supposing they would do such a sleazy thing, for which there's no evidence at all.

It may be possible to improve on the current arrangement, but from where I sit it does not appear that the sky is in danger of falling.

Thumpernator

07-26-2005, 09:52 AM

Jeezzz............And all I asked was who were the new Board Members.

:eek:

KenSandyEggo

07-26-2005, 10:19 AM

You just have to stir up trouble, don't you Dave?

Harry_S.

07-26-2005, 01:32 PM

Yeah, Dave...rabblerouser. :D

ventana7

07-26-2005, 06:18 PM

At the meeting they said a document now exists that says any monies that accrue from any sale of the airport go to PRA not PRA Menone.
Rob

KenSandyEggo

07-26-2005, 06:28 PM

Well if it exists, it should really be easy to scan it and post it here or on the PRA site. I'm going to hold my nose shut and start counting. How high does anyone think I'll get before we see it? We're still waiting for papers that were promised in 2003!

Doug, why in God's name should it ever have to wind up in court? Can you imagine the costs involved? A few people doing the right thing would solve all this.

Dean_Dolph

07-26-2005, 06:32 PM

So Gary's not going to run for president again? What about his position as one of the 2 owners of the airport?.......Ken, Jonathan this is for you also, I don't know if in my simple way I can explain what others haven't been able to. But, the airport is not owned by Gary or any other individual.

The wording was always there but a few of us did not want to accept it as it was. So, the effort was made to change the wording and go back thru all that was required to get the state of Indiana to accept the new document. The new wording should make it clear to everyone that the PRA is the 'Benefactor' of any dissolution of the airport and related assets, period! In case no one understands what this means, it means that any value received on dissolution, if the airport and assets are disposed of, become the property of the PRA.

Just for clarification, I asked about the Mentone BOD and it's makeup at the life members meeting. It is made up of two locals (which is good practice in my mind) and the officers of the PRA. The officers of the PRA are selected and voted on by the PRA BOD. We, as PRA members, select the PRA BOD. If we don't trust the PRA BOD then we have voted for the wrong people and have no one to blame but ourselves. Oh yeah, after all the promoting and what not about sending in our ballots, only a little over 300 were cast. This is just a smidgen more that last year.

I recognize that it is good sport to hang on to this issue but the time has come when it is time to find a new pastime. You can use me as target if you like. I'll just turn a deaf ear!

Timchick

07-26-2005, 07:14 PM

Isn't the airport generating revenue from rent, etc? Does that money go toward the payoff of the airport? Once the airport is paid for where will the revenue stream go then?

KenSandyEggo

07-26-2005, 08:16 PM

So whomever is elected president next year will automatically become the president of PRA Mentone? Who voted Gary in as PRA Mentone president? Better yet, who authorized the setup of PRA Mentone? Why was it a cloesely-held secret for so many years? Why is it like pulling teeth over numerous years to get little bits of info out....like "it's being worked on.....should be ready by the next convention (guess we haven't had one since 2003).....the lawyers and accountants are looking at it."

I never saw such a bunch of gullible dupes in my life. It's apparent that most of you apologists and cheer-leaders jumped in here well past the mid-way point and don't even realize that what you're posting has been posted before and clearly shown to be dubious....like the "liability" crap. The one that I really like is, "of course the president and some board members won't post here because they're not spoken nicely to," or something like that. If an elected board member gets hurt when the members want information on secretive shenanigans that have been shoved under the carpet for years, they have no business running for office. What a crock. I'm sorry I sent in my 40 bucks to this outfit of the begging and willing to be bull-****ted and awe-struck by so-called authority figures. Feh.

KenSandyEggo

07-26-2005, 08:21 PM

"The new wording should make it clear to everyone that the PRA is the 'Benefactor' of any dissolution of the airport and related assets, period!"

Let's see that wording please....or do we have to wait while the attorneys and accountants look at it?

barnstorm2

07-27-2005, 05:13 AM

Isn't the airport generating revenue from rent, etc? Does that money go toward the payoff of the airport? Once the airport is paid for where will the revenue stream go then?

Tim, Tom Milton posted that the revenue goes to the PRA.

Ken, why did I not see your name on the Ballot this year?

Chuck Roberg

07-27-2005, 06:40 AM

Dean, correct me if I'm wrong. Was it not agreed on to publish the new document in the PRA magazine?

Of course with the lead time needed for the publisher it might take two months. I'd rather see it on the PRA web site.

Dean_Dolph

07-27-2005, 03:50 PM

.....Let's see that wording please....or do we have to wait while the attorneys and accountants look at it?For everyone's info, it is my understanding that the PRA treasurer is an accountant. He is the one that led the charge to modify the wording. It is also my understanding that in the process an attorney(s?) reviewed the document. Then again that happened the first time and there were those who didn't want to accept that everything was on the up and up so it is not surprising that they do not want to accept what is in place now.

I would like to point out that in the process of protesting, that all of us that understand that everything is on the up and up are being called sneaky liers with no integrity. Insulting? Sure it is, but I learned a long time ago that when I know I'm right then I don't have to justify myself to anyone and I extend that to the PRA BOD.

I would suggest that if anyone really wanted satisfaction on this issue and it was as important to them, as they try to make it appear by posting here, they would make an effort to arrange a face to face meeting with whoever at Mentone or Bensen Days. Did any of you protestors do that?

Dean_Dolph

07-27-2005, 04:18 PM

Chuck, I took a bunch of notes at both the life members meeting and the general membership meeting and didn't make note if publishing the document in question was agreed too. If you recall, I did push for publishing the financial report but didn't get a definitive answer on whether that will be done. It was standard practice at one time.

I'm hoping that the web site team gets the members only section built soon so that this type of info can be placed there. If nothing else it would release pages in the mag for other use.

I believe everyone on the BOD understands that there is a serious communication problem that needs to be addressed. How it gets addressed is the issue. I never did any serious campaigning for the BOD except for the profile in the mag. And in that profile I made it clear that I felt communication was the key to problem prevention and solving.

It is my observation that there are those on the BOD that quite frankly are afraid of the power of the internet. And why wouldn't they be when all they see is the negative side and not the positive effect it can have. I proposed, and still believe, that a BOD liason role, between the BOD and the Internet community, should be created so that issues that pop up can be handled in a timely manner and the communication becomes two-way. Hopefully these proposals have merit and the BOD will implement them.

Dean_Dolph

07-27-2005, 04:34 PM

So whomever is elected president next year will automatically become the president of PRA Mentone?That was how it was explained at the life members meeting. I would feel better if that explanation became part of the by-laws.Who voted Gary in as PRA Mentone president?Obviously the BOD since they select the PRA officers from their ranks. Better yet, who authorized the setup of PRA Mentone? Why was it a cloesely-held secret for so many years?Secret? I don't think it was a secret and it wasn't even an issue until a couple of disgruntled ex-BOD members decided to make it one. Then the gullible that like conspiracy theories bit and away we went? ..... awe-struck by so-called authority figures. Feh. Ha! Most of my ex-bosses and military officers would be real surprised if you apply that assessment to me.

KenSandyEggo

07-27-2005, 05:48 PM

"For everyone's info, it is my understanding that the PRA treasurer is an accountant. He is the one that led the charge to modify the wording. It is also my understanding that in the process an attorney(s?) reviewed the document."

"......my understanding" X 2 are weasel-words, Dean. Can you imagine someone testifying in a trial and is asked how they know that Ziggy committed the burglary and they say, "Well, it is my understanding." My understanding is that you and others were fed a bunch of hooey. Where's the document for us to see?

Chuck Roberg

07-27-2005, 05:52 PM

I proposed, and still believe, that a BOD liason role, between the BOD and the Internet community, should be created so that issues that pop up can be handled in a timely manner and the communication becomes two-way. Hopefully these proposals have merit and the BOD will implement them.

Dean, I believe Tom Milton has been trying to do just that. He seems to be getting shot down with his every reply. Even though he's no longer on the BOD he still trying. As for me I give up. I'll stick to the other posts. :(

Dean_Dolph

07-28-2005, 04:39 AM

Chuck, I'm not sure that Tom is acting as a liason as much as he is as a defendent!

When I talk about liason I'm talking about someone on the BOD that officially monitors the internet, which includes this forum, and presents issues, attaboys or whatever to the PRA BOD. In turn the liason then presents an official BOD response to issues. The liason could also present BOD questions for the gyro community. Sure, there would be responses from non-PRA members but that is okay in my mind. Since this forum has poll capability it makes it ideal to find out the pulse of the community.

barnstorm2

07-28-2005, 05:56 AM

Dean,

I think that would be a good thing but as we discussed in a thread last year.. Some posters think the PRA has some kind of full-time PR and Legal department running 24/7 to answer every hair-brained hypothsis that comes to mind at 2:30am. If they don't get an answer pronto they start thinking their $40 membership has been robbed and they pitch a fit.

Dean_Dolph

07-28-2005, 09:46 AM

......If they don't get an answer pronto they start thinking their $40 membership has been robbed and they pitch a fit.Well, yeah, but people pitch a fit anyhow! I say if it makes them feel better let 'em pitch it! It's a mental health thing ya know.

But for the majority of reasonable people that visit here I think it would be a good thing. I would expect a PRA liason to have the good sense to recognize who the reasonable ones are. And if not, then disengage as quickly and graciously as possible.

BUD ONEAL

07-28-2005, 01:56 PM

Lets see,
$40.00 per year membership in pra= 10 12 very good quality magazines= several pleasent hours reading the first time.Save them and there is several more very enjoyable hrs. reading
$40.00 = one trip to McDonalds for greasy hamburgers and cold limp fries for four= several hours of bad heartburn for the same four.
I'll take the pra membership any time. I have never been to Mentone and I don't care who runs it,I don't care who owns it. It is there for me to use whenever I do deciede to go.Don't have to be during a convention eithor. It was a good deal then and it is a good deal now. So why not get a life and and enjoy it. None of us has the time to be so negative. Our time on earth is measured and we don't know when the ticket is to be punched,
Just my nickles worthI Bud

Steve McGowan

08-20-2005, 07:25 PM

Think I'll grow peanuts there this year, Or maybe Prickly Pear Cactus, Hell egg plants sounds good.. Or maybe something to help Awad with his headache.

Cotton is a good crop, best yet a set of new gas pumps with an unlimited supply of high-test gas that only I have the combination to use.. No I'd let Ora Cook and the Southern Boys in , But it'll have to age like fine wine till we get back the next year...

Sound great to me.... Oh Yea,,, Gary said it's ok to tell Yall.

Steve McGowan

animal

08-21-2005, 06:39 AM

gyromike

08-21-2005, 10:50 AM

Steve,

Don't forget to build us a crawfish pond too! :)

PW_Plack

08-21-2005, 04:56 PM

Dean said,

"...there are those on the BOD that quite frankly are afraid of the power of the internet. And why wouldn't they be when all they see is the negative side..."

At least one new board member, Jim Mayfield, knew the secret to avoiding the negative side of the forum back in his GBA days. When something's going on, even if it's something with the potential to make you look bad, tell the truth. Then, if there are any remaining questions, tell the truth some more.

This inward-looking attitude has resulted in the PRA having far less influence on a newcomer to gyroplanes than does the internet. If the truth about the BOD's actions with our money would embarrass somebody, then they deserve to be embarrassed - time's a wastin'!