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View Full Version : Groen Brothers working on Military Heavy Lifter Gyro


Heather Poe
07-15-2005, 04:26 AM
http://www.groenbros.com/

From their News Releases tab:

GROEN BROTHERS AVIATION
JOINS THE
GEORGIA INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY TEAM
IN A JOINT HEAVY LIFT PROPOSAL (JHL) FOR THE US ARMY

Atlanta, Georgia and Salt Lake City, Utah – July 14, 2005 – The Georgia Institute of Technology, Atlanta, a top five U.S. graduate engineering research university, with the top public aerospace engineering program in the country, including a world renowned rotary wing technology program, and Groen Brothers Aviation, Inc. (OTC: BB GNBA), Salt Lake City, the world’s leading autorotative flight technology company, announced jointly today that they have formed a team, led by Georgia Tech, that includes Shafer Corporation, one of this nation’s most capable systems engineering and integration technology firms, and Dancila LLC., developer of important new piezoelectric, flow control, and “smart-material” technology. This “Best Value Team” has developed and presented a proposal to the United States Army for the US Military’s Joint Heavy Lift vertical takeoff and landing (VTOL) aircraft Concept Design Analysis (CDA) competition. Lockheed Martin Aeronautics (stock symbol “LMT”) and Rolls-Royce Gas-Turbine Engines (stock symbol “RYCEY”) have both indicated a willingness to support this team if granted one of the CDA awards. It is anticipated that up to five teams will be selected and funded to proceed with CDA development.

The Georgia Tech Team proposal is based upon the “gyrodyne” concept long espoused by Groen Brothers Aviation and extensively researched by Georgia Tech. A gyrodyne is similar in appearance to a helicopter and like a helicopter is capable of hovering and VTOL. Unlike a helicopter, however, a gyrodyne’s rotor is driven for hover, takeoff and landing, by tip-jets at the end of its rotor blades, not by the main engines, thereby eliminating the need for the cost, weight, and complexities of a main transmission, tail rotor, and tail rotor drive system typical of helicopters. The tip-jet approach substantially reduces the aircraft empty weight, compared to a similar helicopter thus increasing payload and range, critical requirements in the JHL competition. Furthermore, the tip-jets are only used briefly in the takeoff and landing phases being turned off in cruise flight when the aircraft flies in autorotation as a non-powered rotor gyroplane (technology Groen Brothers has specialized in for nearly two decades). In this mode, the aircraft is capable of substantially higher speeds than any conventional helicopter, also a critical JHL requirement.

“As the Groen Brothers have been articulating for years, the gyrodyne is a very cost effective, high performance, and safe VTOL aircraft - technology that should have had its own evolution into the modern age. With advances in turbine engine and rotor technology applied to the gyrodyne concept, it now can” said Dr. Daniel P. Schrage, Professor and Director, Center of Excellence in Rotorcraft Technology (CERT), and Director, Center for Aerospace Systems Analysis, School of Aerospace Engineering, Georgia Institute of Technology. “It is only right and proper that it should be considered for heavy lift, as it scales up favorably with gross weight while most other rotary wing concepts do not. We are at the right time, the right place in history, and we have the right team to make it happen.”

“This powerful team is capable of creating an aircraft that the US Military has been dreaming of for many years: a vertical takeoff and landing (VTOL) aircraft able to carry the Future Combat System loads at high-speed and long range without the need of runways, and, most importantly, is affordable!” said David Groen, President & CEO of Groen Brothers Aviation. “No other design that can meet these mission requirements will come close to this design in affordability - of development cost, production cost, operating cost, and life cycle cost. No other design can compare in reliability and therefore mission readiness, to the elegant simplicity of autorotative flight.”

In its proposal the Team intends to use a Lockheed C130 Hercules as its test vehicle, fitted with a tip-jet powered rotor designed by the Team. The use of the fully developed C-130 as the base aircraft will add meaningfully to the affordability and the timeliness of the development project. The Team is therefore particularly pleased that it has been formally advised by Lockheed that if and when it is successful in its bid, Lockheed will be pleased to support the Team’s effort. Rolls-Royce, the manufacturer of the engines in the C-130J will also be available to provide technical support to the team as needed.

Professor Daniel Schrage, a former Army aviator with combat command experience in the Vietnam War is a graduate of the United States Military Academy at West Point. Prior to coming to Georgia Tech in 1984 to lead the Georgia Tech Center of Excellence in Rotorcraft Technology (CERT), Dr. Schrage was an engineer, manager and senior executive with the U.S. Army Aviation Systems Command (AVSCOM). In these positions he was involved in the design, development and airworthiness qualification of all the Army’s current combat aviation systems, including the UH-60 Black Hawk, the AH-64 Apache, the CH-47 Chinook, and the OH-58D Kiowa Warrior. As the Director of Advanced Systems for AVSCOM he oversaw Army Aviation’s Science and Technology Program and lead the concept development for the LHX, which lead to the development of the RAH-66 Comanche.

Schafer Corporation has spent more than thirty years developing a reputation for quality and integrity while providing important support to aerospace industry's innovations for the future. Dr. William Marx, the Schafer JHL Best Value Team Program Manager, leads a motivated, talented, and creative staff who are in large measure responsible for developing Shafer's outstanding technical capabilities in the area of systems engineering and integration.

Professor Stefan Dancila, has developed technology that may be a key to creating tip-jet performance enhancements beyond anything ever before contemplated. Dr. Dancila will also be providing important scientific support in this program's use of composite “smart materials.” In addition, his innovative approaches to flow control will also be considered for incorporation.

This technology also directly translates to any size commuter airline aircraft. Commuter airliners now account for 40% of all commercial airport landing slots. Most commercial airports in this country are operating in excess of design capacity - now a greater number of daily movements than even before 9/11. Growth in demand on these landing slots is accelerating because the population is getting larger and the percent of the population that flies is also getting larger. And, the percent of landing slots being used by small commuter airliners is growing, which instead of increasing passenger through-put, actually decreases through-put. This reduces the average number of passengers per landing slot at a time when the world's airports are nearly desperate for the ability to increase those numbers.

Safe and affordable commuter airliners that do not need runways will have a dramatic impact on freeing up these limited landing slots for larger and more profitable airliners. This will significantly increase passenger through-put and delay the need to build enormously expensive new airports and new runways. City center to city center operations of these VTOL airliners can further relieve pressure on this nation's overcrowded airports.

“The successful development of this technology will have an impact on the world's transportation system that will be unlike anything seen since the advent of the Jet Age” said David Groen, GBA’s President & CEO.



Safe Harbor Statement/Forward Looking Information Disclaimer
Certain statements in this news release by Groen Brothers Aviation are forward-looking within the meaning of Section 27A of the Securities Act of 1933, as amended, and Section 21E of the Securities Exchange Act of 1934, as amended. Forward looking information is subject to risk and uncertainty. Certain statements in this Press Release may contain forward looking information that involves risk and uncertainty, including but not limited to projections for deliveries, sales, and other trend projections, including receiving US Government research grants. Actual future results and trends may differ materially depending on a variety of factors, including the Company's successful execution of internal performance plans; product performance; risks associated with regulatory certifications of the Company's commercial aircraft by U.S. and foreign governments; government bid uncertainty; other regulatory uncertainties; collective bargaining labor disputes; performance issues with key suppliers and subcontractors; governmental export and import policies; and the ability to adequately finance operations including meeting its debt obligations, to the date of FAA certification, manufacturing, and delivery of products.

KDOG
07-15-2005, 05:43 AM
Cool, but the C130 has a really tall tail. I wonder if they are going to modify it to accomadate the rotor span, which will have to be enormous...

Chuck Roberg
07-15-2005, 06:00 AM
I heard about this proposal 3 weeks ago. It's not mentioned, but 2 of the engineers who worked on the Fairey Rotodyne project will be working with Groen Bros. as well.

In order to secure the military contract it will have to vertically lift a 40,000 lb. load. Transport it 1,000 miles. Then set it vertically down again.

Big order. I hope they can pull it off. Sounds like they have some pretty smart people on board.

skyguynca
07-15-2005, 06:06 AM
The Rotordyne was a remarkable achievement, and it did prove itself along time ago. If they are building from its experience and using Rotorydyne engineers I am sure they can pull it off just fine with modern engines and materials.

Rotor-Head
07-15-2005, 08:36 AM
I wonder why the rotordyne never caught on... I have a few cool videos with it and it surprises me that tit never went into production....

Heather Poe
07-15-2005, 08:48 AM
Shawn,

This link discusses why the Rotodyne never caught on:

http://www.groenbros.com/tech/FaireyRotodyne.htm

Heather

Dean_Dolph
07-15-2005, 10:38 AM
Dr. Bruce Charnov's book 'From Autogiro to Gyroplane' covers this in detail.

Canadian Rhino
07-15-2005, 02:07 PM
Kdog, I have a picture of the prototype and they have modified the tail to a large horizontal with 4 smaller verticals. ;)

Dale Young
07-15-2005, 03:53 PM
The "Heavy lifters" have been in the works for at least a couple of years now. I have a Popular Mechanics issue that shows some proposals from both Carter and Groen. If I can find it , Ill post the pix. These things are HUGE, FAST and lift a LOT!!! One kinda looks like a C-130 with a rotor!

donshoebridge
07-16-2005, 04:36 AM
Cool, but the C130 has a really tall tail. I wonder if they are going to modify it to accomadate the rotor span, which will have to be enormous...

I think what they'll do is change the horizontal stab to except 2 vertical stabs attached to the tips of the horizontal, and point them down. Very similar to the Rotodyne tail, but hopefully better looking. :)

Heather Poe
08-05-2005, 11:11 AM
http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/aviation/1280746.html

bones
08-05-2005, 01:34 PM
Heather, I'm sorry for not reading your first post fully prior to writting this, but why are these people trying to make a thoroughbred/ show pony do the work of a clydesdale, like i mean, why not just continue to use heavy lift helicopters??
a couple of reasons, 1. surely helicopters will be more fuel efficient. 2. helicopters have been proven

Heather Poe
08-05-2005, 02:01 PM
Mark,

I do not know helicopters very well. However, when I compare two two-person aircraft, a Robinson R22 and a Sparrowhawk, in a dubious apple to oranges comparison (http://www.robinsonheli.com/r22specs.htm, http://americanautogyro.com/SparrowHawk%20Specifications.htm):

Sparrowhawk: 6 gph, $20 per hour operating costs, 650 pound useful load
R22: 8-10 gph, $78 per hour operating costs, 400 pound useful load

This suggests that gyroplanes potentially can lift heavy loads more efficiently than helicopters. Gyroplanes are also typically much less complex than helicopters, also suggesting reduced operating and maintenance costs.

Practical gyroplanes have a longer history than helicopters. In fact, gyroplane technology was used to make helicopters viable.

The articles states:
"Helicopters have a limited lifting capability compared to cargo planes. The trade-off is their ability to operate without a runway. Gyroplanes offer the perfect compromise between lifting capability and versatility."

Heather

david holmes
08-05-2005, 02:38 PM
"Follow the Money"!!!!
There are lots of things that don't make sense to me but one can find the real reason by just looking to see where the money goes.

Iraq is one of them.

drifter57
08-05-2005, 09:35 PM
I am wondering how they will overcome the huge C130 wing area blocking the downwash in VTOL and hover. That thing is going to kill a good percentage of the lift.

drifter57
08-05-2005, 10:02 PM
Second thought. Does the bernoulli effect develop lift in this case? Can the airflow across the top of the wing counter the drag under the wing? Any Groen folk, or more knowledgeable engineers than I care to wade in?

RayPierce
08-06-2005, 05:17 AM
I am wondering how they will overcome the huge C130 wing area blocking the downwash in VTOL and hover. That thing is going to kill a good percentage of the lift.

I would think the lift would be generated from the air coming from the nose of the aircraft instead of beneath it.
Similar to a bi-wing aircraft.
Remember a gyroPLANE takes off and lands like a plane.
Hover? Get a helicopter.

Rotor Rooter
08-06-2005, 10:48 AM
Very Heavy Lift (http://www.unicopter.com/1461.html) :D

Steve McGowan
08-29-2005, 05:57 AM
Long as I can get it into my trailer,, It'll work..

Or Vice Versa

Hognose
09-22-2005, 08:39 PM
Unfortunately, the Pentagon just doled out a big sum of money for heavy lift research, and they skunked Carter and Groen, or any other gyroplane/gyrodyne project.

They threw a lot of money at quad-tiltrotors, an ABC counterrotator, and a tandem machine from Boeing that is basically the next step in the evo of Frank Piasecki's ideas. All but one of the contract winners are big aerospace primes.

The new guys must not know who to bribe yet.

cheers

-=K=-

Hognose
09-22-2005, 08:59 PM
To be specific (in alphabetical order):


Bell Boeing’s Quad Tilt Rotor, claiming a cruise speed of 275 knots
Boeing’s Advanced Tandem Rotor Helicopter, 165 knots
Frontier Aircraft’s Optimum Speed Tilt Rotor, 310 knots
Sikorsky’s X2C, X2 Technology Crane with a coaxial rotor, claiming 165 knots
Sikorsky’s X2HSL, X2 Technology High Speed Lifter, advancing blade concept compound helicopter, 245 knots



Frontier Aircraft's website (http://www.frontieraircraft.com/ has been an "under construction" page for three years. Not sure how they are but kind of suspect "minority set-aside business" -- a venerable Pentagon contracting scam. The more so since they are in Irvine, CA, a legendary incubator of Asian-owned businesses. An earlier website http://www.recce.com/ appears to be abandoned, but makes some really wide-ranging (and therefore suspect) claims about Frontier's competencies.

Hard to believe that this paper outfit, Frontier, won a $5-6 million research contract over real innovators like Carter and Groen who have flown real hardware. But then, the President just named some unqualified bimbo who has never supervised more than three people in her short life to be the head of Immigration and Customs Enforcement -- apparently because she's General Myers's niece. So maybe this Frontier outfit is one of those deals.

Then again, if Bell-Boeing can build a quad TR that'll go 275 knots, for anything less that $100 million a pop, I'll eat a C-130. Heck, the V-22's gonna be $100 million a pop if the services and Congress keep monkeying with the program.

cheers

-=K=-

KenSandyEggo
09-22-2005, 10:04 PM
Heck, Moeller got that much of our tax dollars from our D.C. idiots for his vaporware a few years ago. I think he had his hand out for a 2nd 5 million, but I don't know if he got it. When he got the first 5 million, he had one employee listed besides himself.

Hognose
09-22-2005, 10:07 PM
That's truly depressing, Ken.

Moller is working on "life-extension technology" now. Apparently he fears that he may pass away and leave future generations without scam artists (he needn't worry).

cheers

-=K=-

Rotor Rooter
09-23-2005, 12:37 PM
Well, at least all five got one thing right.


http://www.unicopter.com/No_Tail_Rotor.gif

Canadian Rhino
09-23-2005, 07:21 PM
Here is a link
http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/bus/stories/092005dnbustiltrotor.d421ae1.html