View Full Version : Alternatives to 4130???
02-02-2005, 08:06 AM
I am looking an alternative to the 4130 steel...Any ideas? :confused:
02-02-2005, 08:42 AM
Out of curiosity - why? Are you having trouble locating supply, or are you looking for a different material for some other reason.....
02-02-2005, 09:24 AM
Which begs the question- an alternative to 4130 in what application? What are you building?
The 4130 alloy is frequently used in aircraft because it has a good combination of workability (cutting, forming, welding), strength, and (with treatment) corrosion resistance .. have you picked a machine to build? Scratch built or kit? Which one?
02-02-2005, 12:09 PM
Let's say to built a Barnett J4B2, is there an equivalent tubing, to the 4130, which is cheaper but with the same qualities?
02-02-2005, 02:58 PM
nothing has the same qualities, you will have to use something with less in one or more areas such as weldability, tensile strength, hardness, fatigue characteristics just to name a few. For years in the early days cold rolled steel and die pulled steel was used with good results but it is heavier and does not have the hardness of 4130. Just remember you take your chances when you change a designs proven material.
02-02-2005, 03:17 PM
Compared to the cost of the Continental engine and the rotor the cost of airframe metal is insignficant- this includes the fact that (if your experience is anything like mine) you'll probably fabricate almost everything at least two or three times along the way. =)
You can get the 4130 tubing and sheet you need for your project from Aircraft Spruce, Wicks, and/or several other vendors .. I bought six flavors of 4130 (bushing, round tubing, sheet, and square tube) from AS last week and all were in stock. Even if you find a great "deal" on metal you still need to pay something for it and using a vendor who will let you order small lots, will take returns, and can provide you with certified sources has significant value in a scratch builder cost/benifit equation.
02-02-2005, 04:01 PM
4130 tubes are really inexpensive, unless yo uneed specific shapes. I don't see something better for the cost... but if you look for an european equivalent, there is the 25CD4S steel, the properties are similar.
02-03-2005, 04:47 AM
OK, that's what i wanted to be told!...
02-04-2005, 09:44 AM
Hello all, why not to use stainless steel??, in Europe there are some autogyro that uses them. 4130 tensil strenght 57 Kg/mm2, and stainless steel AISI 304, 52 Kg/mm2
Thank You. Franco
02-04-2005, 09:57 AM
Stainless isn't anywhere near as workable as 4130 .. homebuilder can fabricate stuff out of 4130 with simple tools and a portable gas welder. Titanium and carbon fiber look like great materials based on stiffness and tensile strength but trying to build something out of them without proper tooling and experience would probably be more than a little frustrating.
Stainless is not a material for airframes, it has a very low resistance against deformation and it is dangerous for welding.
It is designed for the food industrie.The only pro is the corrosin resistance.
4130 is designed for aircraft use.
02-17-2005, 07:32 PM
A good source for tube and other materials: www.airpartsinc.com/
02-17-2005, 08:14 PM
4130 is the standard for good reason -usally in the normalized condition for toughness.
What about welded aluminum tube? faster than bolting, but heat treatment after welding is necessary to achieve good properties. Titanium is the other material i would consider - it will not corrode, and is 2/3 the weight of steel - special equipt needed to weld it.
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