Risky??? nah, pice of cake.

[birdy]

Hada interestn time this arvy.
Yesterday i was ,........... lookn at moos on the ground bout 100 miles from ere [ vidio to come] and took the oppertunity, while i was close to town, to pickup a hyd motor i had ordered a few days ago.
After id finish 'lookn' at moos, i had enuff time to get close to town, and am glad i did, coz it stormed all nite.
This mor'n it was near clear skys, and i borrowed ol mates ute and picked up the bits, but on the way out, the f%$#n rain had come back in and it was p1ssn down.
Waited till bout 2pm and the cloud was liftn, so i strapped me gear on, [bout 50KGs worth] filled up n took off, only to find that wen i got high enuff to see over the foot hills, it was still lite rain'n and only 100 foot of clean air under the clouds.
But, I wasnt stayn this close to town and pressed on.
Had to take sum auto parts out to where i was yesterday, but wen i got there it was rain'n, and wet as hell, so i just flew slow at 100' and droped um out.
Started the 100 miles for home and the wether was realy lookn unnice. i had two options, the usual way, through the big gap, but i couldnt even see it only 5 miles away for the rain, so i took the second one, cross through a pound and over the rim onto a big plain.
Looked good till i got to the west entry of this pound as the rain settled in heavier, but i [thought] i could still see the rim on the other side through the rain, with open gaps under the cloud, but it turned out this rim was actualy only a few small hills in the middle, and wen i passed them, i couldnt see any horison.
Startn to wunder if i went the rong way, but it didnt matter, i still had plenty of options, fuel and time left.
Kept headn to the rim, but with no GPS, compass or sun, only rain and cloud base at 100' and dropn, things werent lookn good.
Passed a coulpa landmarks i knew of from previous trips through ere and found and old road that i knew would lead me to a gap in the rim that hopefully will be below the cloud.
Thinkn that if the worst happened, i can still put down sumwhere and wurry bout getn back up after the rain cleared.
Landn options were very thin tho, with nuthn but an old overgrown road windn its way up, over n round rocks, rocks n a few more rocks, not to mention water.
Wen i finaly reached the gap, i found the cloud was as good as on the ground. Any higher n 50' and i could barely see the ground, and horisontal clarity wasnt real good either, so i had the stay at tree top level and not stary too far from this road.
This gap wasnt 20 yards wide, bout100 yards deep and well into the cloud both sides, with the cloud base rite at the same level as its highest point, occasionally dissapearing as a bit of low cloud passed through.
"Kinda run'n outa room here" i was thinkn as i circuled tight over the raod wundern wot i was go'n to do next.
Iv flown blind before, and didnt like that one bit and go'n blind this close to rocks wasnt my idea of fun.
But as anyone knows whos been in low cloud, the base aint smooth. its more like an upside down ragen sea, with low bits n higher bits, so i reconed i just had to wait and time my dash through this gap wen a higher bit went though.
After 10 mins of round n round i finally time it rite and sliped though, 5' off the rocks and still in heavy misty cloud, but clear enuff to see the rocks both sides only feet from the rotor. The turbulance down wind of the gap hepled me drop quickly with the side of the mountain so i wouldnt loose sight of the road, coz i knew if i stayed over the road till out of the cloud i wouldnt hit anythn.
Was very comforting the break out of the blind cloud into light rain, with sunshine only 30 odd mile ahead.


Note: the only reason i didnt turn back or land, but took wot mite have seemed to sum a very risky option, was coz i knew zactly wot was on the other side of the gap.
Even lookn through the mist it looked like a short dead end coz theres anatha mountain and a tight rite hander only 100 yards past the gap. If i hadnt seen it in clear air it woulda looked like a dead end
and i surely wouldnt have attempted to go blind, usen only the old road as guide.

NEVER FLY BLIND.

[StanFoster]

Birdy- You are my hero. Man, you have more experiences that require being one of the best gyro pilots to pull off. My adrenalin is rushing. I am a huge coward of weather. I may have forced the envelope of my helicopter the other day, but if I can't see at least a mile, and have a good ceiling, I am either staying on the ground or getting down. Good job of keeping your cool. Stan

[Doug Riley]

Birdy, you have carb heat? My 912S used to ice up just a bit on a long final in wet weather. It quit once from ice just as I touched down. I would think that, if it wanted to ice, it would gladly do it inside a cloud, where humidity is always 100%.

[WaspAir]

I am a huge coward of weather. I may have forced the envelope of my helicopter the other day, but if I can't see at least a mile, and have a good ceiling, I am either staying on the ground or getting down.

Weather cowards die in bed of old age. It's a worthy goal, and you're on the right track, so keep at it.

Imagine all the howling we'd have heard if Vance had reported a story like this!

[aviatakl]

Birdy, that was a great real-time story mate, hey which way from Alice are you, out towards Gosses Bluff? I have spent a long time out there, when I was part of a drilling crew with the BMR. Did a special core drilling program around Gosses with NASA. As the impact fracture has shatter cones in all directions, and Nasa were doing geology training for the first Moon astronauts. Spent some time up at Dingo Flat as well. U253 all over the place up there mate.
Stay safe mate.

[Chuck Roberg]

I'm with WaspAir on this.

If anyone else had posted this I would have thought what an idiot. But I do have faith in Birdy's skills and reasoning. Otherwise I don't think he would have lasted this long.

[ckurz7000]

Birdy, you have carb heat? My 912S used to ice up just a bit on a long final in wet weather. It quit once from ice just as I touched down. I would think that, if it wanted to ice, it would gladly do it inside a cloud, where humidity is always 100%.

The new 912/914 from Rotax have a sleeve around the intake which gets heated permanently to comfortable temperatures so that icing isn't an issue. Rotax claims that it doesn't take away from power available either.

-- Chris.

[reelmule]

Birdy, Quit trying to win the Darwin award--you may not be holding a Royal Flush the next time!!!

[Friendly]

I think you need to cut and paste that to your memoir's. Then publish for us timid fellows to read.

[birdy]

Doug, mate, i wouldnt have even tookn off if i didnt hava carb heater, coz like you, i know 912s dont like moisture.
I was more conserned bout rotor ice, specialy with the extra weight and, unloadn the blades be'n your only cure of rotor ice, i didnt hava lota room to do any sustained unloadn.

Imagine all the howling we'd have heard if Vance had reported a story like this!
Wait for it. ;)

hey which way from Alice are you
Over ere. [ east]

Birdy, Quit trying to win the Darwin award
Walt, this little stunt is pretty lame if you compare it to 24 hours earlier. ;)

[Redbaron]

ey bird I think its about time you just put up with that nose bleed and climb higher mate! just kiddin! rotor ice can't be good, seems just a little would cause extreme stick shake!

Doug, mate, i wouldnt have even tookn off if i didnt hava carb heater, coz like you, i know 912s dont like moisture.
I was more conserned bout rotor ice, specialy with the extra weight and, unloadn the blades be'n your only cure of rotor ice, i didnt hava lota room to do any sustained unloadn.

Imagine all the howling we'd have heard if Vance had reported a story like this!
Wait for it. ;)

hey which way from Alice are you
Over ere. [ east]

Birdy, Quit trying to win the Darwin award
Walt, this little stunt is pretty lame if you compare it to 24 hours earlier. ;)

[Learjet]

Not to spoil the praise-singing & adulations, but irrespective of the knowledge of the terrain or thousands of hours flying experience...as little as just a half a degree C drop in ambient temperature and it could have gone clampers with cloud right down to the ground in a matter of minutes with a very different ending.

[Resasi]

As happened with that unfortunate couple in the Magni down your way Dave ( Lear) a couple of years back.

[birdy]

as little as just a half a degree C drop in ambient temperature and it could have gone clampers with cloud right down to the ground in a matter of minutes with a very different ending.
???????????
Wots clampers?
If im ignorant of sumthn ere mate, i wana know, please.

[ms80831]

as little as just a half a degree C drop in ambient temperature and it could have gone clampers with cloud right down to the ground in a matter of minutes with a very different ending.
???????????
Wots clampers?
If im ignorant of sumthn ere mate, i wana know, please.

Birdy. I think what he is trying to say is if the temp had dropped to the dewpoint, it could have gone zero zero (no ceiling - zero forward visability) IE: clamped to the ground with thick fog, in a matter of minutes.

Mark

[ms80831]

Weather cowards die in bed of old age. It's a worthy goal, .....Imagine all the howling we'd have heard if Vance had reported a story like this!

You're right J.R. .

In US airspace, this would have violated several FAR's and the laws of common sense. But in the Outback, it's a great story, ....until we hear the bad news some day.

Honestly Birdy, this sounds like you took an unnecessary risk. This was not
a life or death flight. It's sounds like classic get home itis.

(VFR in IMC in an aircraft with no instruments !) How much skill and experience does one need if the weather in this story had dropped to the dewpoint, and a pilot was at 100 agl in zero zero visability conditions heading for a rock cliff that takes a sharp turn ahead, flying over a narrow rocky road you can no longer see ?

More skill than I've got. My skill and experience says not to get into that situation.

But, in fairness, that is from what I READ. I was not there.

It may have been marginal, but ok to take a look. I can not judge.

You lived, so either you were lucky, or the conditions were different from how I IMAGINE them in my head when I read your story.

That said, great story, don't stop telling them, just be here to tell the next one.

Fly safe my friend.

Mark

[Russ Hobbs]

Damn Birdy, don't be pushing that envelope to hard. It would be damn dull around here if you put her down hard mate.

Russ

[Resasi]

Having experienced the results of temp changes that resulted in rapid deterioration of visibility I can vouch for Birdy's descriptive use of 'interesting'.

In all those situations but two, I had alternates and the fuel to get to them. As for the two they will remain 'interesting' memories for ever, as well as permanent warnings on how things can go wrong.

I am sure most of us have at least a few of these for various situations.

[birdy]

Thanx blokes.
I appreaciate your bluntness in telln me to not push me luck.
I probably am ignorant of the speed at which visability decreases, but like i said, there was never a moment that i didnt have more than one option.
Yes, i was in the cloud base and visability was fluctuating, but i could always see the ground [ coz i was never more n a few feet off it], i had plenty of options to spot land, i hada constant updraft from the wind blown up to the gap, and at no time could i not see a good safe distance the way i came. If i had to back out, it woulda ment decending outa cloud as i followed the ground down, into wind.

Im in the habit of not leaven meself without anatha option.
And im not in the habit of flyn in cloud, they are usualy way too high for me.

It's sounds like classic get home itis.
Your rite, there wasa bit of this itis to it. I had no intention of campn up there that nite. But sure asa bear sh1ts in the woods, i woulda landed if id run outa options.

[C. Beaty]

Birdy, as a practiced, practical psychologist, you’re able to spin your tales in a way that sets the hand wringers a-wringing.

[EI-GYRO]

How many inches of rain did you get this year, Birdy.?

[birdy]

practiced, practical psychologist,
Friggnell CB, i bin called alota things before, but thats gota take the cake.
Wot the hell dose it mean? Sounds scarey.

Over 32" so far EI.
3 times as much as we'v had in the previous 10 years combined.

[Redbaron]

"spinning the story" you made the experience more dramatic telling it than it really was! fisherman do it all the time " I caught a 7 ft cat fish but he got away, ya should of seen it!" it was probally a 3 ft catfish and he snapped your line! :twitch:

[ms80831]

........there was never a moment that i didnt have more than one option.
Yes, i was in the cloud base and visability was fluctuating, but i could always see the ground [ coz i was never more n a few feet off it],



Dang Birdy, you made me spray my drink all over the screen.

I was in the clouds , but I could always see the ground because I was practically on it.......Classic. :)

Your style and unique word-smithing makes reading these posts a real delight.

Fly Safe my friend

Mark.

[pilotescort]

Birdy, you're a tuned-in pilot that would make an excellant CFI. Seems to me you had your options well in hand, understood the situation, and knew your skill level. The problem in America is that hang-nails have become justified heart attacks giving way to a bunch of sisies. The worst of them become the authorities who make sure nobody developes their gonads. The only acceptable risk here is in a g@#%$#m video game. Congratulations on being REAL. :first:

[WaspAir]

Birdy, you're a tuned-in pilot that would make an excellant CFI. Seems to me you had your options well in hand, understood the situation, and knew your skill level. The problem in America is that hang-nails have become justified heart attacks giving way to a bunch of sisies. The worst of them become the authorities who make sure nobody developes their gonads. The only acceptable risk here is in a g@#%$#m video game. Congratulations on being REAL. :first:

Wow - you managed to get three of the FAA's five "hazardous attitudes" crammed into just one paragraph (anti-authority, invulnerability, and macho). Actual CFIs in the U.S. are supposed to teach aeronautical decision making free of such things (see, Aviation Instructor's Hanbook, page 8-17 http://www.faa.gov/library/manuals/aviation/aviation_instructors_handbook/media/FAA-H-8083-9A.pdf , and Advisory Circular AC60-22 chapter 3 http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgAdvisoryCircular.nsf/list/AC%2060-22/$FILE/Chap%201-3.pdf ), not promote the development of gonads. Next time you encounter another pilot or a member of the public who treats gyro pilots as wackos and nut-jobs, think about where they get such ideas.

[pilotescort]

Next time you encounter another pilot or a member of the public who treats gyro pilots as wackos and nut-jobs, think about where they get such ideas.

I don't feel Birdy demonstrated any hazardous attitudes, he simply was on a mission in combat mode. By all means, I am not promoting hazardous attitudes. The point is that too many people project their own limitations upon others unfairly, and government sponsered social programs always fail because they don't address the individual. I don't consider Birdy, Patty Wagstaff, or even astronaughts "nut-jobs". All flights have a certain risk, and too many accidents happen when weather is NOT a problem. People get their assumptions and ideas from their OWN fears, and as they judge so shall they be judged. Reading flight books doesn't make you a pilot, flying does, although literature can be helpful. Thinking your Superman will probably kill you. It boils down to individual common sense, especially in aviation. Like Dirty Harry said, "A man has got to know his limitations." When the "mission" is a success it matters little what others think. My applaude of Birdy stands.

[Resasi]

No one would dispute your applause, any more than the applause a Rodeo rider gets for staying on that Bull. That takes skill, strength, courage and the ability to bounce.

That rider might also be a great riding instructor.

I think the question was simply whether his attitude towards risk is the best one for a new student who may not have the raw talent from the get go??

Birdy does a job that requires him to be constantly in low high G turns hour after hour. He has years, and thousands of hours of experience and is in a league of his own and we all love seeing a virtuoso perform. It is always a delight to watch.

Would love to see more mustering vids Birdy, though with all that vegetation one doesn't get quite as good a view as the one you did when it was bare and dry.

[pilotescort]

Weather cowards die in bed of old age.

Talk about having a hazardous attitude!!! I'm glad my CFI never told me that on a cloudy training day.

Thank you Leigh, for no student should consider this thread one of training, otherwise it would be an "accident discussion". Advanced pilots, such as Birdy, perform seemingly miracles in flight. These are NOT junior skill level techniques. I think J.R. actually was impressed with Birdy's skill, as I am, though he would never suggest a student to follow suit, nor would I.

[EI-GYRO]

[QUOTE]he simply was on a mission in combat mode. /QUOTE]

Yeah, right. He was heading home.

I enjoyed the story.

[Friendly]

[QUOTE=Resasi;394186] He has years, and thousands of hours of experience and is in a league of his own and we all love seeing a virtuoso perform. QUOTE]

Virtuoso?? Birdy has me confused, because he has posted for years, that he is just a SCG and he wears the sandals to prove it.

[birdy]

I think the question was simply whether his attitude towards risk is the best one for a new student who may not have the raw talent from the get go??
Leigh, [as i stated in the opening post] , i would never had attempted the gap if i didnt already know wot was on the other side. That would be suicide.
Yes, sum of the yarns i spin, and sum of the flix i post probably do hava bearing on sum idiots flyn habits, but only coz he's an idiot, not coz he saw or read it.
I could keep it all to meself, but then how will the ignorants of the world know the abilities of our gyros?
Im not the only one do'n it, im just the only one witha good camera.

I can safely say iv been indirectly responsable for at least 2 accidents. [ one very serious].
One bloke didnt listen to the fine details wen he asked me bout sumthn and rolled it ina ball.
The other didnt have the machine to be do'n it, and didnt read everythn i said, and didnt heed the warnings id posted.
Neither had the airtime to be do'n wot they were attempting.
And I didnt hold a gun to either blokes head.

No one says we should stop super car raceing coz the drunk dicheads think they can do same, just after the race, and T bar a power pole.


Virtuoso?? Birdy has me confused, because he has posted for years, that he is just a SCG and he wears the sandals to prove it.
Duno wot a virtuoso is Mark, but you can be certain a SCG aint one of um. ;)

[Mark E]

Interesting point Birdy makes; as soon as we see a clip of someone hotdogging in a gyro, someone will usually have a go at them (unless it's Birdy we are talking about, of course) ... But what about those guys all racing bikes and cars , and how about those crazy guys on the big bikes on the Paris Dakar etc? Sure as heck they have a bad influence on the average motorcyclist?

For that matter, why is there no gyro racing (oops, can see everyone reeling back in horror from their computer screens right now!)

Anyway, just sayin'..... :drum:

[helipaddy]

For that matter, why is there no gyro racing (oops, can see everyone reeling back in horror from their computer screens right now!)

But microlight racing looks like fun,

YouTube - Micro Air Racing (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzSjj64XpLI)



Now a Dominator race series around pylons.....

[bones]

ohhh my all this on the web, wonder how many thruster pilots are going to go out and try it

[birdy]

Gyros are tailer made for low n slow.
So hava low n slow race [ 2 foot off the trees], the last bloke home wins. ;)
[Like golf, the bloke with the lowest score wins.]

[Redbaron]

gyro pilots and fixed wing pilots are the same the difference is when the engine quits! a gyro pilots get a much better view of the ground rushing towards their legs! gyros are definatelly funner tho! :rolleyes:

Jeff "sinkin like a sum bitch" S


Gyros are tailer made for low n slow.
So hava low n slow race [ 2 foot off the trees], the last bloke home wins. ;)
[Like golf, the bloke with the lowest score wins.]