What Subaru ????

[jawbrey]

Have Read Alot About Subs I Have Looked At Old Threads But I Cant Find Anything On What Years To Find A Suitable Engine Prefer Carb
And Simple Ignition System [no Complicated Efi And Ecm Wiring To Deal With] I Some Times Find Myself In A Wrecking Yard. Would Like To Know What To Keep My Eye Out For?



James

[GyroRon]

EA-81 and EJ-22

[automan1223]

Welcome to the Rotary Forum !

You have to ask yourself a few questions.

What are you looking to build ? How many people will it carry ?

Will it be a heavy or lightweight machine ?

What atmospheric and runway conditions will you be flying in?

How much will the pilot and pass weigh ?

What kind of performance envelope do you want to fly ?

These are all very serious considerations and need to be honestly addressed before you go picking up an engine.

I suggest you find the next gyro fly in and go and ask questions take notes pics and find out before you start to build and then have to sell it all because you did it all wrong.

Sincerely
Jonathan Weis
Oriental NC

[jawbrey]

maybe a dominator with a pre rotator,single seat,i don't know what it will weigh..but,not ultra light.
altitude at my local airport..460 feet above sea level
pilot..250 lbs
i want enough power to have fun(maybe 70 to 80 mph) top speed

thanks,james awbrey

[Mike Hook]

Here is a list I found of the Sub's

Years Engine
Subaru 2WD models 1.1 - 1.6 Auto Parts 70-79 1.1-1.6
Subaru 2WD models 1.6 & 1.8 Auto Parts 80-84 EA71,81
Subaru 4WD models exc. Brat Auto Parts 80-84 EA71,81
Subaru 4WD models exc. Brat Auto Parts 75-79 EA63,71
Subaru 4WD Turbo exc. Brat Auto Parts 83-84 EA81T
Subaru Baja 2.5 Pickup Auto Parts 2003 EJ25
Subaru Brat 1.6/1.8 Pickup Auto Parts 77-81 EA71,81
Subaru Brat 1.8 Pickup Auto Parts 82-88 EA81
Subaru Brat 1.8 Turbo P/up Auto Parts 83-84 EA81T
Subaru Forester 2.5 Auto Parts 2003 EJ25
Subaru Forester 2.5 Auto Parts 98-02 EJ25
Subaru Hatchback OHV 2WD Auto Parts 85-89 EA71,81
Subaru Hatchback OHV 4WD Auto Parts 85-89 EA81
Subaru Impreza 1.8 2WD Auto Parts 93-96 EJ18
Subaru Impreza 1.8 4WD Auto Parts 93-97 EJ18
Subaru Impreza 2.0 TurboWRX Auto Parts 02-03 EJ20
Subaru Impreza 2.2 4WD Auto Parts 95-01 EJ22
Subaru Impreza 2.5 4WD Auto Parts 02-03 EJ25
Subaru Impreza 2.5 RS 4WD Auto Parts 98-01 EJ25
Subaru Impreza2.5TurbWRXSTI Auto Parts 2004 EJ25
Subaru Justy 1.2 2WD Auto Parts 87-94 EF12
Subaru Justy 1.2 4WD Auto Parts 88-94 EF12
Subaru Legacy 2.2 2WD Auto Parts 95-98 EJ22
Subaru Legacy 2.2 2WD Auto Parts 90-94 EJ22
Subaru Legacy 2.2 4WD Auto Parts 90-94 EJ22
Subaru Legacy 2.2 SOHC 4WD Auto Parts 95-99 EJ22
Subaru Legacy 2.2 Turbo 2WD Auto Parts 91 EJ22T
Subaru Legacy 2.2 Turbo 4WD Auto Parts 91-94 EJ22T
Subaru Legacy 2.5 4WD Auto Parts 00-03 EJ25
Subaru Legacy 2.5 DOHC 4WD Auto Parts 96-99 EJ25
Subaru Leone/Loyale OHC 2WD Auto Parts 85-93 EA82
Subaru Leone/Loyale OHC 4WD Auto Parts 85-94 EA82
Subaru Leone/LoyaleTurbo2WD Auto Parts 86-90 EA82T
Subaru Leone/LoyaleTurbo4WD Auto Parts 85-90 EA82T
Subaru Outback 2.2 SOHC Auto Parts 96 EJ22
Subaru Outback 2.5 4-Cyl. Auto Parts 00-03 EJ25
Subaru Outback 2.5 DOHC Auto Parts 96-99 EJ25
Subaru Outback 3.0 6-Cyl. Auto Parts 01-03 EZ30
Subaru Outback Sport 2.2 Auto Parts 96-01 EJ22
Subaru Outback Sport 2.5 Auto Parts 02-03 EJ25
Subaru SVX 3.3 2WD Auto Parts 94-95 EG33
Subaru SVX 3.3 4WD Auto Parts 92-97 EG33
Subaru XT 1.8 2WD Auto Parts 85-91 EA82
Subaru XT 1.8 4WD Auto Parts 87-91 EA82
Subaru XT 1.8 Turbo 2WD Auto Parts 85-87 EA82T
Subaru XT 1.8 Turbo 4WD Auto Parts 85-87 EA82T
Subaru XT6 2.7 2WD Auto Parts 88-91 ER27
Subaru XT6 2.7 4WD Auto Parts 88-91 ER27


EJ-22
Subaru Engine Specs and Designations

Last updated July 19, 1999


Posted by Witte; from Ultimate Subaru Message Board, additional info from GeoffreyR

year General Size Actual Size HP Torque Designation Notes all unlisted cr are 9
70-71 1100 1088 62@6000 63@3200 unknown FF1 Not SAE rated
71 1300 1267 80@6400 73@4000 un 1300G Not SAE rated
72 1300 1267 61@5600 65@4000 un 1300G
73-74 1400 1361 61@5600 69@3600 EA-63 1400
75 1400 1361 58@5200 68@2400 EA-63 1400 2wd
75 1400 1361 56@5200 67@2400 EA-63 1400 4wd
76 1400 1361 58@5200 68@2400 EA-63 1400 2wd cr 8.5
76 1400 1361 56@5200 67@2400 EA-63 1400 4wd cr 8.5
76-79 1600 1590 67@5200 81@2400 EA-71 1600 2wd cr 8.5
76-79 1600 1590 65@5200 80@2400 EA-71 1600 4wd cr 8.5
80-82 1600 1595 68@4800 84@2800 EA-81 1600 cr 8.5
80-82 1800 1781 72@4800 92@2400 EA-81 1800 2wd cr 8.7
80-82 1800 1781 71@4200 92@2800 EA-81 1800 4wd cr 8.7
83-87 1600 1595 68@4800 84@2800 EA-81 1600 cr 9
83-84 1800 1781 73@4800 94@2400 EA-81 1800 cr 8.7
83-84 1800 1781 95@4200 123@2800 EA-81T 1800 turbo cr 7.7
85-87 1800 1781 73@4800 94@2400 EA-81 Brat, 85 2dr GL
85-89 1500 1595 69@4800 86@2400 EA-81 2dr
85-86 1800 1781 82@4800 101@2800 EA-82 4dr
85-86 1800 1781 94@5200 101@2800 EA-82 GL-10 MPFI & XT
85-86 1800 1781 111@4800 134@2800 EA-82T turbo
86-94 1800 1781 90@5600 101@2800 EA-82 SPFI
86-89 1800 1781 84@5200 101@3200 EA-82 SPFI 4dr 2wd
87-88 1800 1781 84@5200 101@3200 EA-82 carbed
87-91 1800 1781 97@5200 103@3200 EA-82 XT MPFI
87-90 1800 1781 115@5200 134@2800 EA-82T turbo
87-93 1200 1189 66@5200 70@3600 EF-12 Justy carbed.
88-91 2700 2672 145@5200 156@4000 ER-27 XT6 (coolest of all 2 valve)
90-93 2200 2212 130@5600 137@2400 EJ-22 Legacy
90-94 1200 1189 73@5600 71@3600 EF-12 Justy MPFI
92-94 2200 2212 160@5600 181@2800 EJ-22T? Legacy Turbo
92-97 3300 3318 230@5400 228@4400 E?-33 SVX
93-96 1800 1820 110@5600 110@4400 EJ-18 Impreza
95-96 2200 2212 135@5400 140@4400 EJ-22 Legacy,Impreza
96 2500 2457 155@5600 155@2800 EJ-25 Legacy


Mike

[GyroRon]

I would not use a Subaru on a Dominator. I would stick with the Rotax engines period. On a heavier machine I would consider a Subaru and would either use a EJ-25 with Direct Drive, or a EJ-22 with a Reduction drive. The Dominator won't support the weight of a EJ sub IMHO.

[_MOL_]

James,

If you are going to choose a single seat Dominator, and you want to use a Subaru engine, then use the EA81 only. The EJ series will be to heavy and powerful I think.

There are single seat Dominators made installed with SUB4/EA81 or Autoflight/EA81 (almost the same). Talk with Ernie about it.
Or ask Neil Hintz in New Zealand, he builds a lot of special Dominators installed with Subaru engines.

Im sure someone on this board has a Subaru powered Dominator, maybe they can tell you how to do.

[GyroRon]

Well I know three owners of Single place Dominators that have Subaru EA-81 engines on their gyros. One never flys his machine, the other is not sure he likes his, and the last guy has said he wishes he had gone with the Rotax. The Dominator is a very easy to fly and very rock solid stabel platform to fly. BUT.... it is also a hotrod and very nimble and fun to toss around yankin and bankin! Using a heavier engine will take alot of the nimbleness out of a dominator.

And I don't think you would be saving much money going with a Subaru over a nice Rotax. Very low time used Rotax 582 engines sell for around 3500$ complete. By the time you buy a junkyard Subaru and go through it and buy a reduction drive, you already have more than you could have gotten the Rotax for.

Just my opinion.....

[Victor Duarte]

Hi gents,

does anyone remember a Subaru aviation engines dealer in Belgium..
I saw the link somewere here, but i can't find it..

BTW , any infos or remarks about the EJ82 ?

Thanks

[jos]

Hello,

The so called subaru engine dealer is not sure a sub conversion is the best way to go on a single seater.
A four stroke engine in the 60 to 80 hp power range does not perform better in the machine because of its weight.
A 1kg per horse engine for 80 hp horse has 80 kg.
A 582 rotax is around 50 kg installed for 65 hp, the better power to weight ratio makes the single seater more fun.
The sub conversion is for a single seater ok on one condition: you must hate two strokes.


JOS

[Victor Duarte]

Thanks Jos,
I dont really hate 2 strokes, i certainly will go for a 2 strokes.

But i remember hat i had seen that this engine dealer had a soob engine 1,6 , 100 hp that weighted about 55 kgs, i only wanted to give them a call to check if the weight is correct..and the pricing..

Thanks

[Aussie_Paul]

......that has to rebuilt every 300 hours? The extra weight of the Subaru can easily be managed by larger rotor blades to have the disc loading correct. You are right Ron though, in that you lose some nimbleness BUT, you have a gyro that is better for trips and uses straight mogas.

A second hand Rotax, no I could not handle that!!!!!

When I had to use a Rotax I got along ok with them, but they are expensive to operate.

There are 4 things that I don't like about 2 strokes. :eek:

1) high idle, they want ot walk away from you on tarmac.
2) Vibration levels are quite fatiguing.
3) use a bucket full of fuel when you push them around.
4) and the maintainence costs are high if/when things go bad!!!

I enjoy my 4 stroke Subaru's. :D

My suggestions.
1) Get a later ej-20 100hp or 120 hp from a low mileage wreck.
2) Bolt on a Hirth gearbox with an 11lb flywheel.
3) Use the car ecu with the car loom that can be shortened to suit.
4) Use an aftermarket airfilter allowing 8" between the mass air flow sensor.
5) Have an exhaust made.
6) Bolt on a 68" diameter prop, and go flying.

There is no need to tear one of these low mileage engines down. ;) These engines will run several hours after coming out of a 50,000 mile wreck.

I don't hate 2 strokes and as I said when I had to use them I was happy enough, but, I enjoy my 4 stroke Subaru's. :D


Aussie Paul. :)

[Victor Duarte]

Paul, thanks, i need this kind of opinion.

I also know the 2 stroke disaventages. I have to manage a ned for power and a low budget. so, a 912 is out of reach for me , now.

I looked at subaru because it looks a nice engine for a gyro.
what's the weight of an ej20 ? i don't need gearbox, just the starter and generator.
Have you a trick to fit a light starter ?
I have also heard that the soobs need to have the cams changed to give more HP at a lower RPM, has someone a how-to ?

Thank you

[GyroRon]

Paul how many people do you know that overhaul a Rotax at 300 hours? I don't know many. Most people go 2 to 3 times that long before overhaul. I know a few people here in my area running Rotax 503 with over 1000 hours with only maintance being sparkplug changes.

For a small lightweight gyro the Rotax is the way to go. Big heavy two place machines are better served by bigger engines, Subaru is a good one for that application.

[Screw]

Screw-In

Whatever Sub you get, let Automan123 build it for you. His I think is 2.5 and won the thrust pull at ROC with 690lbs of thrust!

Send him a private, yall exchange phone numbers and go to town!

Screw-Out

[GyroRon]

He has a EJ-22. I think he got more thrust that even that Screwybacca

[Victor Duarte]

John, ron, thank you, good info.

I found the site i searched. They talk about soob 1,6 l , they say they get about 100 HP with a naked weight of 80 lbs.. amazing, but i wanted to know how it is possible.
i have no answer yet.
The weight challenge for a soob is different for me, i don't need a gearbox or redrive.
If i can get 120 lbs naked it could be interesting.
But the 2 strokes stills a reasonnable choice..

some said rotax prices increased 20 % is that true?
thanks

[rfi]

Victor,
The 1600 cc Subaru (EA71) weighs around 80 kg, not 80 pounds and it does not develop 100 hp. The single carb model makes 67 hp and the dual carb model makes 90 hp.

[Victor Duarte]

Thanks Don,

In fact i asked for the 80lbs number and this weight is given naked : no cooling, no alternator nor starter, no wiring, nothing, just the block... the final weight is around 140 lbs, you're right.
For info, they machine most of the parts to gain weight and the price is around 10000 $ .

Thanks to all

[Screw]

Screw-In

Sorry Ron Solo, You know I don't know jack about subs. I just know Johnathan (Automan123) had that pine tree screaming for mercy when he was running that thang!

Automan123 builds engines! Get with him on size and type.

Screwybacca-Out

[LARRYEBOYER]

Paul! You is da man! i love the Subaru. I have two of their cars and both run great. One has 113000 and I would jump in it tomorrow and with out hesitation drive it cross country and back. Chris told me a story where a local car dealer has a EJ-22 that had 300000 and put in a car cause the engine ran to well to junk. Paul, I do have a very important question for you. I have a EJ-20 STI Turbo I want to use some day. It has a bent timing belt cam gear. Can you get parts for the EJ-20 in Austrailia? If so would you e-mail me a supplier for subaru JDM parts?

[Aussie_Paul]

Larrye, I don't understand JDM parts.

Aussie paul. :)

[mceagle]

Larry, is yours a quad cam, and if so which cam gear is bent. Is the camshaft itself OK?

[LARRYEBOYER]

Tim, Yes it is a quad cam. The gear is a cast steel gear. It is located (looking right at the gears)on the lower left hand side.I believe I counted the number of teeth. I think it was 48.
Paul, JDM is the japanese domestic market. The engine came out of a car in Japan, but the engines were in Subarus in Austrailia before the US.The engine I have was in a Legacy. It had 8900 miles on it when the car got hit. It was a EJ-20 STI FI turbo. Produced 245 hp.The engine looks like new. Just I can't seem to get the gear.I went to the local Sub dealor and their gears would not work as they were fiber or aluminum with a different configuration. Bummer! I will post a picture of the gear if anyone can or knows of a junk yard or parts store for JDM market engines.Thank-you

[LARRYEBOYER]

Here are the pictures of the EJ-20 timing gear. Anyone can assist me as to how to find one or repair this one? It has a fracture on the mounting face and slightly bent.

[rfi]

Larry,
Did you have Subaru check the EJ20 turbo sprockets? The Impreza WRX is available with a turbocharged EJ20.

[LARRYEBOYER]

Yes, Don. The WRX didn't hit the US till 2000 or 2001. The sprockets are different and won't fit. I am trying to get a address for the JDM market resourse.

[skyguynca]

try www.car-parts.com and do a search, I did and it worked great, oh and do a yahoo search for JDM engines, that is how I got my geo 1.0L