Conglomerate

[Lspav8r]

I often wondered why no one picked up the Ken Brock ball or the Bensen ball and run with it. The plans are available, and if the Hstab was part of the new design or manufacture it should fly just fine with say a 447 or 503, or even a VW or Generac? With all of the improvements already in place on the older machines making them safer than the older ones, it seems a kit could be made available for say 4K without engine.

Perhaps the PRA could pick up the ball and manufacture this proven machine in kit form with all the safety improvements. All profits going to the PRA. 100% kit. If that works then its just a small jump to manufactured models for say 3K more less engine.

Im not a business man in that sence but there are already people making stuff for the Bensen/Brock machines so who knows where it could lead. Im sure precut predrilled flat stock and square tube cant be that difficult to do in bunches with the jigs.

Cant the jigs be gotten from Kens wife or Igors, or was all that stuff thrown out. has anyone ever priced the material that goes in to a Bensen/Brock machine to see where it would come in at in price?

Just a thought people. I do have a lot of free time on my hands. Its the bane of my existance.:lalala:

Someone else may ahve already gone through all this already but I am in the dark on that.

[PW_Plack]

Jim, if I had lots of time and the inclination, I wouldn't be trying to reinvent that wheel. I'd be attempting to turn out really basic 4130 steel frame kits for welding, maybe offering them factory assembled for use in ultralights.

There doesn't seem to be a whole lot more demand lately for Bensen/Brock gyros than can be met by the used market. Even complete gyros in this class priced at $5K seem to sit for a while before someone buys them.

There are some neat engines available on the low end now. The Generac and Briggs options seem to be increasing in credibility; the Sonex folks now use purpose-built cranks in their Aerovee VW-style engines for under $7K, and what Racer is doing with the Yamahas looks very appealing, especially for heavier machines. There are no doubt breakthroughs ahead.

[Racer]

I agree with what Paul said,
In my opinion the US gyro market is stuck in the 70's with nothing really new coming out at all.
There are newer and better technologies out there that are becoming very reasonably priced that I think are worth checking into.

These guys are working with a small Diesel engine in a snowmobile and knowing how long Diesel engines last and they put out gobs of torque at low RPM's could this be in our future as well?

http://ubsaecleansnowmobile.shutterfly.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4di5dRLXPsc&NR=1

Airframes:
The new composite technologies out there now are nothing short of awesome!
They are even making Jet engine blades out of composite now but where are the new technologies and designs in the gyro world? The Europeans are dabbling with this now and coming up with some really cool stuff, are we going to continue to build Brocks and Bensens and be left in the dust or are we going to forge ahead with new innovations and designs and at least be part of the future.

Just my thoughts.
Todd

[Lspav8r]

I guess I didnt think of the right thing to say when I said it, but what I ws really getting at was a machine that doesnt cost 10,000 to build. Look at the cost of Sport Copters and Magni's, and Dominators. Who in the general public can afford 30 or 40, or 50K for a GYROCOPTER. We need another era of ultralight inexpensive machines that do not need all the certifications to license or fly again. Machines that are new but inexpensive. I think when you start welding fames your asking for lawsuits. Let the public build their own stuff from a kit, that way the onis is on them, unless their is a way to do it without liability issues.

I bought Bensens because they are cheap and they have been around since the 60's. I could never afford the thousands of dollars todays modern gyros are going for, and if I had that much money Id be flying a New LS F/W more practical machine than a 50k toy.

I have nothing against those expensive machines but they are way way way out of my price range for what you get for the money. I will just be forced to improve on the safety and stability of my Bensens unless I win the lottery. Then I would go for the gusto and get a really nice one, cause I would have money to burn.

[Dean_Dolph]

Well, lets see, Jim, there are GyroBee (supported by StarBee Gyros), HoneyBee, Hornet and 3DRV plans available. Those are the one I can think about right off the top of my head. All can be built as ultralights but rarely do they meet the weight because of 'personal' touches added.

It is my opinion that the GyroBee is an improvement over the Bensen/Brock and certainly has a better safety record. That may be because there aren't near as many 'Bees flying as there were Bensen/Brocks at one time.

But, the 'Bee has such a low incident rate, and testimonials from some of our more expierenced and respected pilots, that I'm comfortable in suggesting to newbies that the 'Bee is the entry level machine of choice. And the cost minus the engine is very reasonable. These machines can probably be built for less than $10K but I'm always concerned when I hear a builder say that he can only afford to build a cheap gyro.

If a person has patience (I know, what's that!) and builds as the money becomes available then the more expensive machine(s) is attainable. When it comes to safety and performance, you get what you pay for.

[scottessex]

Problem is that the major components all cost the same no mater what you build, the engine, prop, rotorhead and blades are going to set you back about $7000++, unless you are really good at finding deals, or unless you do LOTS of your own R&D.
You can no longer buy a suitable military surplus engine for $50, or get used helicopter blades anymore because of liability issues.
A new motorcycle will set you back about the same, bass boat even more, new pickup truck, more still. Back in the 1960's a new truck was about $3000. now a new truck with any options is $30k. Gas USED to be $0.25 gal !!! The old days are gone! :(