Balance in side by side design

[Gyro_Kai]

Hello,

I read an article recently about someone doing an approbation flight for a RAF with H-stab. He stated, that he needed a counter-weight of 40 kg (87 lbs) otherwise he had to hold the stick sideways all the time and did not have enough manoeuvering room on that side. Is this really so? How do you guys handle this problem. I understand wife/girlfriend is not always happy to join in on every flight ;) .

Thanks, Gyro_kai

[barnstorm2]

I can not speak for the RAFs but I own a side by side and have 70 hours time in them.

When I was still a low time pilot I would practice with a bag of sand or salt in the passinger seat to simulate the weight of a passinger. This was only for safety and practice reasons since I was still a student pilot.

I found that the only real difference when flying the SxS without a passinger was that the passinger side gear would want to leave the runway a little sooner then my side.

Also, when making an agressive turn you could tell it was a little easyer to turn on the pilot side.

After just a few trips around the pattern you quickly adjust and really don't think anything of it from then on. The adjustment is minor.

If a gyro did not have enough manouvering room on one side when less a counter weight I would highly suspect a serious problem with the gyro!

Again, I have NO RAF experince. Just SparrowHawk and AirCommand SxS time.

Can you post a link or copy of the article?


.

[LARRYEBOYER]

The RAF has a trim system to take the load off the stik when you carry a passenger. If the RAF in question has a trim and still has stick pressure, the chain needs to be tightened more.

[Gyro_Kai]

ah ok, then maybe this particular model didn't have it. How does this trim work? does it shift the rotor bearing to one side, change the stick to rotor connection?

GK

[dragonflyerthom]

The RAF has a trim system. Perhaps he didn't get the 2 degrees left in to the rotor head. This is the off set for the second passenger. If he hasn't done it then you want to tell him. The system is really straight forward when done correctly.

[Harry_S.]

The RAF trim system can be set up several different ways, to suit the pilots preferences

I have the stick itself set a little left of center so that when my right forearm rests on my leg, the circle of my right thumb and forefinger is just right around the stick.

I have taken just about all the R/H roll trim out so that when I'm solo, I'm flying level and with a passenger, I crank in left roll trim.

A really neat adjustable trim system.


Cheers :)

[Gyro_Kai]

So, if I understand correctly, you set the rotor head at an angle away from the direction you sit? could you take a photo of that arrangement?

Gyro_Kai.

[Harry_S.]

So, if I understand correctly, you set the rotor head at an angle away from the direction you sit? could you take a photo of that arrangement?

Gyro_Kai.



Kai, I've been searching for your post and didn't realize it was here in the RAF section. I guess that comes with the onset of AGE. :rolleyes:

Anyway...A photo really wouldn't show you anything as the angle of say, the crossbar, due to it only being offset by a degree or two, if any.

The primary setting/adjustment is accomplished by positioning the component ie, the stick, in place and then adjusting the trim springs to hold that placement.


Cheers :)

[Aussie_Paul]

So, if I understand correctly, you set the rotor head at an angle away from the direction you sit? could you take a photo of that arrangement?

Gyro_Kai.

The usual arrangement is to sit in the left seat when the prop gos counter clockwise as in a belt drive Raf, and in the right seat when the prop goes clockwise as in a gearbox on a Subaru. This gives some opposing force to the prop torque.

My RAF when dual would fly with the cabin leaning a couple of degrees to the right so the cross bar had to be set approx 2 degrees to the left, as per the construction manual, to allow the stick to be central when s/level. Hybrid with the gearbox was the opposite.

IMHO if you sit on the incorrect side solo, with lots of horsepower, you can quite easily run out of side stick.

Even sitting on the correct side in a RAF and conducting a steep turn to the right after take off I could run out of left stick and the only way to allow the gyro to roll left was to reduce power and take away some of the right rolling torque.

Aussie Paul. :)

[Aussie_Paul]

The RAF has a trim system to take the load off the stik when you carry a passenger. If the RAF in question has a trim and still has stick pressure, the chain needs to be tightened more.

Which chain Thom?

Aussie Paul. :)

[dragonflyerthom]

PB

That was Larry B. but I think he is talking about the chain that attaches to the spring and cable of the trim system. It allows for adjustment of the tension on the yoke so the pressure on the cyclic and rotor head can be adjusted and trimmed. Once adjusted it really feels like you have power steering.

[Gyro_Kai]

There seem to be a lot of RAF designs out there. Thanks a lot for the insight. In Europe the general assumption is, that tandem seating is better for that reason.